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Subscribe to RSSIf Mitt Romney gets elected as president and keeps his promise to repeal the 2010 health reform law, more than 72 million Americans will be lacking health insurance by 2030 and health care costs will rise, a report from the Commonwealth Fund projects. If President Barack Obama stays in office, just 27 million will go without insurance and costs will fall, the group predicts.
There are a lot of caveats in the report issued Tuesday by the group, which does research in support of a “high-performing” health system. Romney would also need a friendly (read Republican-dominated) Congress to roll back health reform, and he hasn’t given very many details of his health plan.
Nonetheless the group, which backs the Affordable Care Act, says the Republican goal of more privatization of health insurance would cost Americans more and leave more without any health coverage.
“The Republican nominee has said that, if elected, he will work to repeal the law and replace it with his own vision for health care,” the Fund’s Karen Davis told reporters in a telephone briefing. “Romney’s plan to repeal the Affordable Care Act and replace it with block grants to states for Medicaid and new tax incentives for health plans purchased in the individual market are expected, on balance, to reduce health insurance coverage in every state,” the group says in its report.
The Romney campaign said the report was based on flawed assumptions and depicts “a fantasy world where Obamacare has been a success," according to Politico.
The health reform law has several aims: to get more people covered by health insurance, to lower skyrocketing healthcare costs and to improve medical care.
Most of its provisions don’t even take effect until 2014, when states are supposed to expand the Medicaid health insurance plan to cover more people and set up health insurance exchanges to help people choose a health insurance plan. Some of the provisions that are already in effect are popular -- such as rules requiring insurance companies to cover adult children on their parents’ plans until age 26 and restrictions on cutting off coverage for sick people. Rules requiring free vaccinations and cancer screenings are also in effect.
But Republicans say the law, passed by Congress and signed by Obama in 2010, will lead to higher costs. They especially criticize a provision requiring insurance companies and employers to provide free women’s health coverage, including birth control. They also say it greatly increases the role of the federal government in health care.
They’ve promised to repeal it, despite predictions that this might end up coosting the country more money. “According to CBO (the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office) estimates, repeal would also end the Medicare spending reductions and higher taxes and fees in the law, increasing net Medicare spending by $716 billion over the period 2013 to 2022,” the report notes.
Few deny that U.S. health care needs improvement. The independent Institute of Medicine says the U.S. health care system wasted $750 billion in 2009, about 30 percent of all health spending, on unnecessary services, excessive administrative costs, fraud, and other problems.
The International Federation of Health Plans reported in March that Americans spend more than people in other countries on just about every medical procedure and doctor visit. It found a hospital stay costs an average of $1,825 in Spain, $5,004 in Germany and an average of $15,734 in the U.S. Health spending as a percentage of GDP, according to the group, is 17.4 percent in the U.S. versus 11.8 percent in France, where medicine is socialized, and 9.5 percent in Spain.
But Republicans and Democrats differ on how to fix this.
“With each candidate offering fundamentally different visions for the nation’s health care system, this fall’s presidential election provides a stark choice for U.S. voters,” the Commonwealth Fund report says.
“President Obama supports the goal of near-universal health insurance coverage, by maintaining existing private insurance markets but also instituting tighter and more standardized regulations across the country to ensure a broad choice of comprehensive health plans to all who seek coverage. In addition, federal tax credits would make individually purchased health plans more affordable. The Medicaid program would cover more families with low or moderate incomes,” it says.
“Governor Romney, on the other hand, has not identified universal coverage as a goal. While also supporting a health insurance system based on existing markets, he believes that more limited regulation will ensure a broad choice of health plans for consumers.” He has suggested giving states “block grants” for Medicaid, allowing them to choose more freely who can get this government-funded health insurance.
Currently, about 48.6 million Americans do without health insurance, the Census Bureau says, or just under 16 percent of the population.
By 2030, the health reform law should bring the number of people without health insurance down to 27.1 million people, the report projects. But the Supreme Court’s ruling in June that states can choose not to expand Medicaid could affect this projection.
Many states currently offer Medicaid mostly to pregnant women and children, but poor adults often are not eligible
“In contrast, the analysis projects that Romney’s proposals will increase the number and share of people who are uninsured in every state and demographic group,” it adds.
It says Romney’s proposals would leave 72 million people uninsured in 2022. Most of these people would lose insurance as states further restrict who is eligible for Medicaid, the group said. Under the health reform law, more people would be insured by Medicaid, but under Romney’s plan, even fewer would get Medicaid than already do. Romney’s team has suggested giving states “block grants” so they can more freely decide how to spend Medicaid money.
The Commonwealth Fund also says Romney’s ideas would cost people more of their own money. The health reform law is projected to reduce the cost of health insurance for people who buy it on their own -- not through an employer or government plan -- to 9 percent of their income. But Romney’s plan would raise these costs to 14 percent of income, the group said.
The report also says the Republican plan would raise Medicare costs.
“Governor Romney’s intent to repeal the law would restore the doughnut hole in Medicare’s prescription drug benefit and reinstate cost-sharing for preventive care services and annual wellness visits,” the report says. The “doughnut hole” was a byproduct of prescription drug coverage that required seniors to pay the full costs of their prescriptions for a while once they had spent a certain amount, and up to a higher point.
The group says some of Romney’s proposals would save the federal government money, but would do that by shifting the costs to individuals, not by lowering medical costs overall.
“In July, CBO estimated that a House Republican bill to repeal the Affordable Care Act would result in a $109 billion increase in the federal budget deficit over 2013–2022,” the group noted.
Romney has said his plan to let people buy insurance across state lines will lower costs and increase choice. The health care plan he signed in Massachusetts did get 98 percent of the population coverage but it did not lower costs -- and may have raised them a little. Romney has said the federal government can lower costs by reforming how we pay for health care, but he has not given any details of how he would do this in his presidential campaign proposals.
“Regardless of the outcome of the election, it will be critical for state and federal policymakers, regulators, businesses, consumers, and other key stakeholders to work together to achieve the vision of high-quality, safe health care at a price that everyone in America can afford,” it concluded.
Related links:
Mass health care law proof of empathy, Romney says
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Of course Romney's health care delusions will cost us money. He and his tax and spend conservative buddies buy expensive weapons while bridges collapse nationwide. Conservatives talk about national defense, but they really mean national defense contractors. Not one GOP President has made raises for the military personnel a priority or a reality, period...big on defense c o n t r a c t o r s. And then Romney insults disabled veterans -- he was dodging the draft during the Vietnam War and my Uncle was dodging bullets and died near Saigon..this COWARD insults disabled vets by saying 47% of us expect a handout. WHAT TRASH TALK FROM A MAN WHO'S MORAL COMPASS IS SET TO POINT NORTH WHEREVER THE PROFIT AND MORMON PROPHET LIES...and I mean LIES.
Didn't the troops see cuts to their pay and medical cuts under Obama? Didn't Obama waste over a billion dollars bombing Libya? And how about all his little drone raids? I'm not a Romney supporter, but don't act as if Obama isn't an interventionalist as well. Fact is, both sides are continuing to burn billions on porkulus, foreign aid, overseas deplorments, and other waste while the national deficit is soaring and record numbers of Americans are out of work.
Don't forget to add that Romney SUPPORTS sending "others" to war (meaning anyone not in his family).
This position isn't anything new: its been a republican ideal for YEARS. Do AWAY with any healthcare, Social Security, etc and PRIVATISE EVERYTHING. This is just par for the course for the Rwing ideologues that are consumed with amassing more and more of what they already have TOO MUCH OF (Money & Power). Nothing new - absolutely nothing (except perhaps their 'cheat, lie and steal' seems a lot more transparent these days...).
I do have a question though: if I've been driving my shell-shocked moderate Repub mates to registration places so they change the 'R' to an 'I' after their name, is that illegal? I'm not in Florida, but I was just wondering....
Flatiron: the pay cuts came under Bush - the same one that cut their benefits and let their hospitals DETERIORATE beyond belief (Walter Reed Hospital for example).
And which of Obamas family members did obama send to war? He has been in office for 3 1/2 years and we are still engaged in wars. We are also now involved is several african nation strifes. The vast majority of those who have died fighting in Afghanistan have died there under obamas watch. Today the paper announced we have passed 2000 military combat deaths in that $hi7hole.
Alex,
Walter Reed was deteriorated well before shrub was in office. Even Cnn reported that serious complaints went as far back as Clintons first term on its condition.
Freddy, You rail against romney for his deferments but I bet you praised clinton for his draft dodging while hanging out in England and writing letters of praise to the soviets, who, if it wasn't for them, there would have never been a vietnam war. Such a loser argument you pose.
FlatIron72
No, Obama did NOT cut their pay or medical benefits... in fact he enhanced the medical side of the equation.
So you list cuts under Obama then complain about spending?
Then complain about spending on bombs in Libya while the GOP complains about not doing enough?
And then complain about spending on Drones when, in fact, drones have saved us millions?
Do you have a clue as to what you really want done?
LMarcT:
You said it! The GOP are duplicitous liars. On the one hand they want cuts, and when they are made, they complain. They also lie. Veterans' quality of life has increased with Obama policies.
My husband's employer, one with around, 100,000 employees, notified him yesterday that the only health plans being offered this coming year will be high deductible plans. They sighted AHCA as the reason. The choices are very limited in provider as well. We are not happy. Will someone like to tell me that is helpful to us?
I am a veteran (24 years Navy) and I buy my own insurance. I don't use the VA. I leave that for those who served and need it. I run my own business restoring antique aircraft. I only hire old guys who want to feel useful in their retirement years (and they definitely are, my youngest employee is 76 and my oldest is 89 years old). I don't force them to a schedule either. They come when they can. They all use to build these planes back in the 30's, 40's, and 50's for their respective manufacturers. To many people who are capable of a good living decide to suck on the gov tit when they really do not need to. Sometime in the future I might need to use the VA. But for now I want those who need it to have it and I am just fine paying for my own insurance. I don't feel like I want to take from those who actually need.
dave
Did you retire? Or did you get a dishonorable discharge? I also served over 20 years. I don't use the VA either. But I do use Tricare. So why are you buying your own insurance? Or are you one of these "I am a veteran, I served" bullsh@iters that you see here so often?
lulu
And prior to ahca. What excuse did employers use to drop their employee heath coverage? You didn't think they would come out and say, "we are cutting your health insurance so we can increase our profits" did you?
@dave why are you buying your own insurance when as a retiree you are eligible for TRICARE. I also am a retiree whom uses TRICARE anyone in their right mind would be using the benefits they earned, so did you really serve or are you an INTERNET SERVICE MEMBER?
Look even retiring Senator Webb says that the bill is so big and convoluted that it was the wrong way to proceed. Chunking out various issues such as keeping kids on the policy would have been simple to understand, easy to pass and easy to read. I did not say they dropped all coverage. Have you read the whole thing? What a mumble jumble.
As an ARMY retiree with a son that is about to be a NAVY retiree, I think that Dave is not a retiree and his service is flawed else he would know about Tricare and Tricare for life.
lulu
I have to agree with you on that. But is throwing it ALL out, the right thing to do? That's the gop plan.
What's the matter Budgetmiester wonk Ryan could add the numbers correctly? Perhaps that is the reason he wouldn't explain it because "you people" wouldn't understand it.
Save the nation vote dem Dems in in November!
Lulu98... Sorry to hear that predicament. With 100,000 employees, healthcare cost to the company will be high. My former employer did that high deductable dance for 5 years and eventually eliminated coverage for 10,000 employees and made it a tiered fixed cost subsidy if you get insurance coverage from the providers they have approved. They eliminated vision plan first, year 3, eliminated dental coverage and 5th year, 2009 the subsidy plan in effect. Now they are reducing the subsidy amount
With 100,000 employees, an insurance company carries a big risk but they know how much is their exposure with regards to the age demographics of the employees. Younger employees below 30 are presumed healthy while older employees, 31 and up, there is an age scale of risk factor. Your husband's employer should be able to negotiate for better premium and coverage considering the size of the business.
I do not understand why they use AHCA as an excuse because the provisions do not take effect until 2014. It was intended that way so issues can be addressed before it goes in effect.
@flnobody. Romney does not say that he will throw the whole thing out. He recognizes that there were good parts but there are many bad parts too.
Democrat102012, you should know what you're talking about otherwise you look ignorant. The healthcare plan is NOT a government plan it's still privatized. Stop listening to Fox and Rush then maybe you'll get a clue.
Also Obama is not a Muslim, Muslims cannot drink alcohol, Obama does. you're last sentence makes me believe you're about 12 years old so stop listening to daddy and think for yourself.
No one should be left behind with respect to health care. The big ripoff needs to end. Insurance companies have been in control of your health for too long and it's time to admit that the single payer systems of other G8 countries work better for less money. 3/4 Trillion wasted every year!
Because we have a "for profit" health care system, we must pay the highest medical costs in the world. We also pay the most for drugs. Republicans like to justify this by saying that our medical community is the best in the world, which is a lie. How many of us have access to the best doctors in the world?
No one should have to make a choice between living and dying for want of health insurance. And that is what the Republicans are proposing. Romney knows that someone without health insurance is not going to get treated for cancer by going to the emergency room. And it's just not poor people--there are plenty of people who work who get little or no health insurance from their employers. All those people who lost jobs during the recession and got reemployed did so bringing to their new policies--if the employer offered them--a pre-existing condition. Now Romney wants to side with insurance companies who don't want to cover those conditions--free market, doncha know.
Think about it. The leading western nations guarantee access to health care for its citizens. Citizens are willing to pay more in taxes for it. They don't have to worry about declaring bankruptcy if a family member gets ill and don't have to choose to die rather than burden their family with debt.
This isn't a problem for Romney who doesn't have to worry about his family's medical care. He's 65. I wonder if he's drawing Medicare and social security.
Something everyone glosses over is why the AHCA is more than 2,000 pages. When the repugnant-ones shot down the "public option," as a low-cost, no-frills, (not-for-profit) plan to be offered in addition to the private plans under the AHCA, that REQUIRED copious regulations to be written into the act to stop insurers from taking advantage of you and me (assuming you’re currently insured) and all those mandated to buy insurance under the act that don’t already. Without those regulations, insurers would have been allowed to continue to inflate premiums, deductibles, and reduce coverage across the board while maximizing profits. The AHCA isn’t perfect and will need close scrutiny to catch those companies who try to game the system. There will be plenty. So thank the repugnant-ones for its convoluted nature. But without it, we would go on providing free healthcare to those who could afford it when they accept “free” care under the tax-subsidized Medicaid system. Yes, nothing is free, but at least this act saves the government money while is stabilizes costs once it’s fully implemented. Learn the facts, They're available online for anyone to read. Oh, that's right, repugnant-ones are not concerned with facts. Obama/Biden 2012!
@flatiron
Your garbage about Obama cutting military pay is just a lie on top of a lie. It started out as a series of emails thatoriginated from servers ownbed by Murdoch (Fox) that claimed that Obama was secretly planning a pay freeze for the military. Yours is simply a lie that is an extension of that lie. Here is the snopes ref:
http://www.snopes.com/politics/military/payfreeze.asp
Ditto for cuts in medical care. Another GOP lie.
Your party called for American troops (and many, many billions and lost lives) in Libya. The bottom line is that Bush kept bin Laden alive for propaganda purposes (why kill the boogeyman?) while Obama killed him. Killing bin Laden and 23 of the top 26 al-Quaeda leaders is Obama's score. Bush's score was ZERO. Obama lost ZERO troops in his "drone wars" while Bush lost thousands of America's best. Ole "Mission Accomplished" fooled you that badly? Maybe. But more more likely you know that Bush Junior's wars were losses and Obama is just cleaning up the mess.
@Bubby,
One of the main reasons that ALL legislation is so much longer these days is that they contain page after page of definitions and "clarifications" intended to keep lawyers from finding loopholes and challenging the laws on specious legal grounds. It has caused ALL legislation to bloom by a factor of about eight times. And still lawyers do the same thing. It used to be enough for legislation just to state its intent --- what it was trying to achieve --- and the judicial system would protect the law against lawyers. But that was always setting the foxes to guard the hen house and the reason why many countries do not allow lawyers to ever be legislators or judges.
What did anyone expect from the Commonwealth fund, a huge Obamacare supporter and shill for the democrats using contrived, assumptive and distorted data to support their conclusions. Really now, did anyone expect anything else from them?
Articles such as this from the tabloid known as nbc are simply food for the Obama zombies, and they'll mindlessly eat it up.
The independent Institute of Medicine says the U.S. health care system wasted $750 billion in 2009, about 30 percent of all health spending, on unnecessary services, excessive administrative costs, fraud, and other problems.
What a joke. I am glad to know that a practically a third of all the money that goes into healthcare is wasted. What the @!$%#. No wonder there is so much inflation in the healthcare field. 1/3rd of what doesn't need to. The more I think about these figures, the angrier I get.
To all my detractors,
No I am not on Tricare and I don't need to be on Tricare at this moment. I am under 50 years old and my wife and I use her health insurance as she is an executive and co-founder of a large successful company. It is part of her executive package. The insurance we get thru her is A+++. Exceptional coverages and very little to no cost. Any doctor we want, anywhere in this country.
If and when in the distant future we feel a need to enroll in Tricare and take advantage of the benefits I earned while serving, we will, but as of now we both feel it is more important that we don't and let those who honestly need it be able to have it. We have discussed this several times and when we hit Medicare age we would then use it. For now we just don't need it. Why take from a system we really do not need to take from? To us that isn't fair to those who actually need it. We both make more than enough money to fund our own way. We both take good care of ourselves and are in perfect health. We both have successful companies and are not hurting financially. A simple principle to our life is self sufficiency and saving intelligently for a rainy day, not rely on others to pay our way when we can provide for ourselves. Even though we could have afforded a much larger and more expensive house and cars we didn't feel it was necessary. The more people take the less their is to give. We have tens of thousands of vets who need the most from those programs and for us to take from it means less to them. I recently read a story about a soldier who needed a powered wheelchair and the one thing that was holding it up is the cost. So some private donors stepped up to the plate and got this wounded warrior what he needed. They also renovated his house for him so he could get around it easier. This guy served and sacrificed but the gov couldn't take full care of him because of cost. Stories like this formed our decisions. Our country is broke in case you haven't heard already. When I enlisted in 1983 I did it for the love of my country and not to squeeze every nickle and dime I could from it. I certainly did benefit greatly from my time served thru education and opportunities provided to me. That doesn't mean I feel ill will towards those of you who do use your military medical benefits (Tricare, DEERS, and VA), you earned it. For us it isn't necessary yet.
As for those who rail against insurance companies. You need to look deeper into the problem of medical cost. Hospitals that charge ten to twenty dollars for a tongue depressor when you go in for a cut finger is more of the root of the problem than insurance companies passing on these cost to their clients. Illegal immigrants who use the emergency room for everything from their childs simple cold to gang fight injuries and then skip out of paying their bills, smokers and drug addicts, etc. etc. etc. Medical billing fraud. Also tort reform should be enacted. To many variables are screwing up the system and those of us who live a healthy life style are paying for those who refuse to.
@dave
Another one of the big things that has been driving healthcare costs up is technology. New medical devices are expensive.
These are the same medical devices they use in France, Canada, and the U.K., all offering nationalized health care, but nations whose lower health care costs we probably make possible because we are willing to pay whatever medical providers want to charge us.
The only reason we don't have universal health care is because Donors bribe senators and representatives to throw their constituents under the bus so that they can continue making the big bucks off you.
EVERY non-partisan health care group says, after studying both plans extensively, that Romney's healthcare plan will cost us more and leave more people uninsured than Obamacare.
The discussion is over.
The Commonwealth Fund, by the way, is a well-respected NON=PARTISAN foundation that looks at health care in America.
It objectively weighs various plans in Congress and gives the unbiased pros and cons.
dave, Obama ended the war in Iraq, a war that was started to give billions in contracts to Halliburton, a company that employed and still pays Bush and Cheney (Cheney actually created the law that allows the military to hire private contractors while he was under Bush Sr.). Bush took troops OUT of Aghanistan, the war we should have been fighting, and put them in Iraq. So, "wars" is incorrect. Obama ended a trillion dollar sham of a war.
Health insurance costs have been skyrocketing for at least the last decade. More and more employers have been dropping coverage, because they can, much like they did with retirement in the name of more for the management and less for the workers.
This past year, after the ACA, rates increased 4%. Some, including myself received rebates because they had to spend 80% of the premiums on actual healthcare. Of course mandated private insurance was a Republican idea. Hospitals and insurance companies signed on because they would have less write offs from uninsured patients. In exchange they agreed to some fairness. It never ceases to amaze me that the small government crowd will accept any amount of crap from the "private sector".
Citizen calls for help with health insurance went unheeded by Republicans. Democrats delivered.
Emily, Clinton awarded a no bid contract to Haliburton in Bosnia well before Bush and Cheney. Please get your facts straight before you comment and make an ass out of yourself. BTW, Cheney did not create that law. You missy, is a lieing sack of democratic @!$%#e.
Preach on Freddy, preach on!!
Gee....... Republicans lie............I am shocked. Oh wait that would be if they told the truth I would be shocked. Sorry my head spins not understanding exactly why the Republicans hate America so much they would destroy it rather than work to fix it.
healthcare cost will be down but do we get the same services? why everyone so hype about free healthcare where Canada and EU want to revert that system? who will pay for free healthcare? TAX Money and of course by 2016, definitely Obama will be out of the office and yes new administrative will increase TAX to pay for free healthcare. Wake up Americans!!! nothing is free.
I'd rather pay MY government for MY healthcare, rather than some fat cat CEO who makes 20 million a year off of my premium. I'd also pay less to the government than to the private "insurers", I mean swindlers.
Because the government manages our money so very well. That is not a partisan point because the parties both mismanage.
mua ha
You are right. The same ones who paid for the free healthcare that people got before the bill was passed. Do you really think that the hospitals just eat the cost of people who come into the emergency rooms/hospitals with no insurance? No, they billed the state for it. Now think about that for a minute. Where does the state get their money from? What for it........ YES! The taxpayers. Go figure.
I suppose that under AHCA all the doctors and other medical professionals could quit their jobs to make a better pay repairing cars, but I don't think so. Our care will be the same if not better under the AHCA. Additionally, I don't know where the "Canadians don't like their health care system" comes from, but I have a compelling idea. Canadians that I have spoken with, like their system and laugh that someone else says that they don't.
Single payer means that instead of paying a lot more to insurance companies, you pay for your health care as part of your taxes. It will cost less. 17.4% of gdp in the US vs 10.5% in Canada. Canada has better average outcomes and much less malpractice.
@MuaHa,
You are completely and absolutely WRONG about "Canada and the EU want to revert (sic) that system." First there is NO EU system. Each country has its own healthcare system and they are not interchangeable. Each EU country treats its own citizens except for emergency care. Secondly, neither Canada nor the EU countries have any interest in "reverting" to anything like the US for-profit medical system. Why would a Canadian want to see his prescriptions drug prices increase by four and 30% of every healthcare dollar disappear into the maw of capitalism? Canadians constaltly DO complain about how the GOP misrepresents and lies about its health care. The French have the #1 health care system in the world. They pay half of what the US does per capita, but covery EVERY citizen (and even American tourists) with the best health care in the world. Why would they want to cut over half their citizens off from it, pay double, and slide from first to 42nd just to be like the USA? Europeans do not want their health care system to be just like America --- in fact, they make fun of the US system. Europeans call the American system a "death system" instead of a healthcare system. You obviously do not know even a tiny bit of what you are talking about.
demo
Like they have been doing for years? For higher profits.
You don't have any idea what the truth is.
A Canadian college student came here in 2010 and 2011 to vacation.We were talking one day about health care and he said that was one big plus living in Canada.He said how nice it was to never have to worry if you had enough money to pay for health care when you were sick.He couldn't imagine how we lived without a national health care service.So no I don't think Canadians want our system at all.
Mya, um when did Canada and the EU want to REVERSE there system. Last I checked the Canadian population was VERY happy with their current system. The health care won't be free, it we be more affordable and cover more people. We have a system that is broken our current president is trying ot fix it. I'll take that over the opposition who is determined that nothing is done.
so healthcare cost will down how is about the services! remember Canada and EU offer free health and TAX is up the roof and service SUCK!!!! Sooner we will do the same "paying HIGH TAX" for free healthcare. Nothing is FREE come on Americans Wake up!!!!
remember Obacare will be in full effect 2016 and Obama will be out of the office. Who will guarantee us no tax HIKES?
Mua HUH? WHERE in the hellfire do you GET your (false) info? Taxes are higher to cover the medical, yes: but let tell you what, honey - I'd rather wait in line at NHS and get stitched for FREE than have to pay 500.00 (half up front) to go to A&E (or what you people call the Emergency Room). Secondly - where do you get off making these HYUGE and FALSE claims that Canada and the EU are trying to 'revert'.... to WHAT? Thirdly: Canada's service DON'T SUCK!!!! AND on top of that, the drugs are a LOT CHEAPER!! Maxalt (a major Migrain med) in the US: 135.00 per pill W/OUT insurance out of pocket. Canada (at Northwest Drug (same pill) 21.30 w/out insurance out of pocket. Conclusion: you don't know WHAT you're going on about!
YOU'RE the one that needs to wake up - while you've been spewing this untrue bile, you've been floating completely OUT TO SEA.
Gee Alex, I sure do hope that the free health care does a better job than the free education you got in this country. Your spelling, grammer, and punctuation is atrocsious.
Mua Ha - Remember when Willard said people living in apartments just call Emergency and they will take care of you?
Well my son and his wife where rear-ended on their way to Las Vegas celebrating their seventh anniversary
My Daughter-in-Law was taken to Emergency - for tests - Cost - $9,000 - Repeat $9,000 no injuries just tests - explain that to me - $9,000 ?
Is this insane or what?
Yes they have insurance - is that why they where charged this ridiculous fee to cover the uninsured?
And the person who hit them will cover the charges - why not? But don't you find this ridiculous - I do
I have European family and Canadian friends. They love their health care. It does not "suck"
I have a Patient whose sister lives in Canada and has been waiting for a CT scan for 2 years. She is feard to have cancer and yet she is put on the waiting list. Yes Canada had a great system...let the people die.
beanne
Sure you do. You had her on TV the other day too, right?
You are confused, that's the gop plan.
Mua -- Have you ever experienced the NHS system? I have, tt's wonderful. I am also a military spouse in a remote location in the UK. Tricare works over here, but it's easier and faster to go thru the NHS system. Yes, their taxes are high, but in talking to my friends and neighbors, they would rather have higher taxes than no NHS.
Taxes are going to go up in the near future. It does not matter who is elected.
Now, who is going to be paying more and what it will be spent on...that is a different question.
I lived in Canada for over 35 years and can tell you straight up that you are full of it.
Canadians pay 5% more overall in taxes than US citizens for their "free" universal health care...no one pays for emergency services, tests of any sort, surgery of any type, doctor visits or extended care. Drugs are far cheaper because the government can negotiate with the pharma companies (something Republicans made illegal in the US).
Canadians look at the US health care system as a barbaric joke and in no way would want to lose what they have.
Universal health care without the cost of middle man, Wall St insurance companies or for profit hospitals is the only sensible direction for the US to go. The rest of the world figured this out 40 years ago and just shake their collective heads at the tragic fiasco that is the US system.
@MuaHa,
I am 68 and took a pass on Medicare Parts B and D. My wife is still working and I am on her Blue Cross because it is cheaper and better, but here are some facts:
1) Medicare at best is a third-rate system. It is a broken doiwn Ford, not a Cadillac. Compared to most other countries' systems it is a joke. Why? Because it is expensive for the insures, and covers the three most important areas to older people very poorly: vision care --- NONE, dental care --- NONE, and prescription drug care, so bad it actually kills people. But it is still better than what most people in this country have.
2) Medicare Part D is exactly like Obamacare in that it MANDATES that you purchase rotten coverage from private insurance companies who profit hugely because they wrote the law. If you do not subscribe to Medicare Part D instantly when you become eligible for Part A (which is "free"), you are fined $5,000 if and when you eventually subscribe. In addition, your premium goes up 1% for every month you delay getting Part D --- with no cap or limit. There is NO appeal for either. Both the fine and the penalty are taken from your Social Security checks at 100% until satisfied (though you still remain liable for income tax on them.) The "donut hole" was killing thousands of seniors every year because it led them to be on drugs that they had to quit during the year because Part D stopped paying for them. The rebound effect from stopping such drugs as hypertension drugs was literally killing thousands of seniors every year. AHCA tried to close some of it, but it is still there and still killing people the "Republican way."
3) I get most of my prescription drugs from Canada (Illegally, thanks to the GOP.). They are made by the same companies in the same plants in India and China that I would get here. The drugs should be more expensive in Canada because they are subject to Canadian import duties. Instead, most of my drugs are cheaper, including postage, shipped from Canada than the co-pay here. Only a few generics are cheaper here and then only because of the postage.
4) The US health care system is currently rated 42nd in the world. That is down from 37th when Bush W took office. It is anticipated that Obamacare MIGHT raise it back to close to 37th again. The French system is number one and is half the cost per capita. Yep the French would like to see it cheaper, but their main complaint is the same as Canada --- American "terminal illness tourists" --- people with cancer or other serious illnesses who go across the border and declare themselves "in extremis" to get the French or Canadian (or British or Dutch, etc) medical care which is far superior. Canada has recently passed legislation to stop Americans from swarmeing across the border for medical care. The French have, so far, resisted such laws on humanitarian grounds, but that is likely to change. And BTW, the old GOP garbage about fporeigners coming to this country for medical care is essentially a lie. Some do, but many times more go to Europe, especially to Switzerland, France, Germany, and Britain. They come more often to the US for things like cosmetic surgery because the US does a great deal more of that sort of thing.
5) Canada is a great example of what money is doing to the health care system. They had reached a point that unless you lived in a major city, you had no access to medical care of any kind. Over 90% of the area and around 65-70% of the population had no access to physicians, nurses, hospitals, or clinics. The best they could hope for was an air ambulance system manned by EMTs --- not a good thing if you are having a heart attach while fishing on Hudson Bay --- 7 hours from a hospital by air ambulance. The reason was that the for-profit medical system only wanted to do mnedicine where there was money to be made. The Canadian system had devolved into a US model that was more successful at breast implants than cardiac shunts. The Canadian people, not their government, changed it. Yes you can find people who are dissatisfied in Canada, but most of those want more coverage and improved facilities and are willing to pay more to get it.
6) It is almost impossible to get an unbiased comparison of the French and American healthcare systems from people who used both systems. (I actually used the British health care when I worked at the US Embassy in London.) That is because the French system is so much that the American system that anyone who was not biased would be discredited automatically. But here is a very good comparison: http://reason.com/archives/2009/12/07/why-prefer-french-health-care
The trolls who badmouth foreign healthcare systems and praise our own simply have no basis for comparison except Fox News and political lies. Ours is crappy by world standards. But if you want to make the comparisone for yourself, I have a suggestion: There are a large number of web sites that privide English-speakers with e-mail "penpals." Mostly these are people of all ages who simply want to improve their conversational English --- students, business people, and people thinking about coming to this country as tourists predominate. Ask them about their health care. Ask them about its costs. Ask them if they would "revert" to an American system. Ask them if they would come to this country for ANY medical procedure except cosmetic surgery. Ask about "death panels". Ask about costs. Ask about both waiting times for an appointment and in-office waiting times. Ask them for yourselves. They will be happy to discuss it with you. Just don't be surprised if they lecture you a bit about your ignorance. Most people in foreign countries, especially Canada, are really sick and tired of hearing feckless Americans telling lies about their healthcare systems.
Chris,
That was replete and brilliant. Kudos and thank you.
There's no need to discuss Romney's health care policy unless he plans on running for the newly-created position of 'President' of the Great State of Utah.
I see everyone is still attaching themselves to POTUS's legs hoping for the big handouts. That will never happen. When will you all take of the blinders and scabs from your eyes and see what he and his minion's are doing to us. Another 4 years of him we will be lockstepping to a one world order. Be warned....
MLS - How old are you - what is your background in life? Until you post I want your bio
Sorry little boy I worked since I was fifteen - look at my SS# Card - I also paid at the maximum into SS# for thirty five years at the top making a six figure income - so don't ever tell me I'm a free loader
Further - each one of my three children have worked through high school - through college - and have always paid into this system - some at the lower amount - most now at the top - so cut your crap we paid and have paid
Geez Barbara... How do you know he was talking to you? No one ever stated that anyone collecting SS is taking a hand out.. (Another Dem lie)
I don't understand why you would think that. Maybe switch to De-caff?
This is typical liberal crap - "millions will be without insurance".
Guess what? Millions HAVE BEEN without insurance.
Millions WILL BE without insurance with Obama's plan.
Why???
Companies are already looking for ways to avoid the HUGE payments Obama's plan REQUIRES.
One way they will do that? Drop insurance altogether and let the Federal govt handle insuring their employees thru Obama's Plan. How cheap will coverage like that be?? Like nothing you can imagine. The cost? Like nothing you can imagine. Medicaire on STEROIDS. The Feds will have another Medicaire headache like the trillion dollar joke they currently have to pay for thanks to 1960's Democrat idiot LBJ.
And OBama supports his stupid Obamacare plan 110% He is an idiot.
Oh, but you Democrats dont want to hear the truth, so let's get back to the normal MSNBC lies and misdirected truths:
Obama is great
There do you feel better??
Obama is a joke who cant even lead his dog to take a poop.
Look up the word failure in the dictionary and there is a picture of Obama sitting on his Kenyan home porch reading the Muslim book of Koran.
The moment you take the blinders and scabs off of yours MLS-2216369!
The "Commonwealth Fund"? Give me a break. These must be a bunch of well-intentioned, ignorant airheads. The claim that health insurance costs would rise under Romney's plan is ludicrous, because Romney hasn't detailed a health care plan, so what the hell are they talking about. Most likely Obama's reelection and little else.
I've experience first hand the lies behind our so-called Affordable Healthcare Act. Obama appeared knowledgeable and convincing as he faced the cameras a couple years back and promised that if we liked the insurance we already had that we would be able to keep it. What a load of crap!
As soon as Obamacare was passed, health insurance companies nationwide made dramatic increases in premiums charged to individuals and employers due to the more costly items they were now required to provide. My wife's employer provided health insurance went from $1200 deductible with free wellcare and small copays on her meds.....up to $4,000 deductible on everything including her meds which now cost us over $1300 per year.
My coverage on her policy was to rise from $40 per month premium to $320 per month. That forced me to drop out and sign up with a Medicare HMO plan with Group Health. Thanks to Obamacare, I am now another burden on the Medicare system and all you hard working taxpayers out there.
Yes, I'll vote for Romney with his promise to repeal this legislative abortion. As for the folks at Commonwealth Fund, my advice to you is to get off your ass and go out and do some field work out here in the real world so that you'll know what the hell you're talking about.
The increases may have started after Obamacare passed for you but it increased for my wife and me before. So your claim of Obamacare making insurance go up is BS. I'd also like to know what company you had that gave you insurance for $40 a month. That's unheard of!
Sounds more like his wife's company stopped subsidizing spousal coverage, that has nothing to do with AHCA.
Thats his wife's company making a bigger profit.
Oh and that Medicare HMO you picked up, they get EXTRA money from Medicare above and beyond what Medicare would pay for your healthcare to provide the SAME healthcare to you as traditional medicare. So you aren't just a "burden" on Medicare, your choice took Medicare funds from others to pay for your Medicare Advantage plan so you are an EXTRA burden on Medicare.
And how dare that company want to make a profit the nerve of them! just a reminder a company can't grow their buisness unless they are making a profit which means they can't hire more people either!
My companies insurance has gone up every year since I started which was 1999 but never by more than a couple percent until they passed Obamacare then it went up 13 percent and we just got the renewal information and it's going up another 20 percent. Also my employer told us the portion they pay will now be added to our w2's because we will have to claim that as income on our tax returns!
To the doubters,
The company my wife works for is a family owned commercial real estate management company in Western Washington. My wife's healthcare plan was 100% paid for before and after Obamacare, but her deductible changed dramatically as I stated. Spouses of employees with more than 5 yrs service DID get cheap $40 monthly premiums. That company changed healthcare plans twice since Obamacare and each being more expensiver than the previous one. And I'm sure the company no longer wanted to give coverage to spouses which is why I would've had to pay full price to remain on her plan....which I couldn't afford. (I'm 69 and a former Panasonic warehouseman retired after the company outsourced our jobs)
Yes, healthcare costs rose before Obamacare industry wide, but nothing in comparison to what's going on now. Perhaps you union members out there are shielded (for now) from the kind of increases we've seen personally, but your time is coming soon.
And, yes, I am an extra burden on Medicare since I have Medicare Advantage. On the other hand, who knows? I just got a letter from my Group Health Cooperative that my particular plan (for diabetics) won't be offered as of Jan 1st, so I have some insurance shopping to look forward to. Oh, joy!
Obama (smiling): "You'll be able to keep the healthcare plan you already have!"
Me: "Blow it out yer butt!"
Update to my cancelled Medicare Advantage Plan by Group Health.
I just got GH's available Medicare Advantage plans for 2013. Yes, they stopped offering my "Clear Care" plan but have replaced it with "Clear Care Essential" plan. Basically they had 3 Clear Care plans, and they replaced all of them by adding another word such as "Essential", "Optimal", etc.
After an hour pouring over the literature I found that the new Clear Care Essential would offer exactly what I had before at an increase of 35% above my current monthly premiums. I suspect there was something within the thousands of pages of Obamacare that prevented them from merely raising my premium 35%, so they had to rename the plan and offer it as something new. Thanks, Barack!
Are we going to see our health care service repealed every time a different political party takes office? Don't we have other things to do?
Dear Confussed,
No. We're just going to repeal THIS kind of healthcare legislation.....the kind that is created behind closed doors, the kind consisting of thousands of pages that nobody read before voting on it, and the kind that has increased healthcare costs instead of lowering them.
AMEN Beangrinder.
At least someone here has a brain that functions properly.
What is the squadron for your patch? I was with VS-22 flying S3 Vikings. Checkmates.
Obamacare has lowered my costs and allowed my kids to stay on my insurance. It's the greedy CEOs of the private insurers that CHOSE to raise your costs.
As I pointed out before my husband's employer is only going to offer high deductible plans. They are a very large employer. They site AHCA as the reason.
My Insurance has doubled...my copays went up...and now I hear it is going to go up again. Hospitals started to be finded yesterday under this Obamadon'tcare plan if a Medicare Patient returns to the hospital in 30 days of discharge.....really. I have been an ER RN x 24 years and do you know how many times a medicare Patient returns to the Hospital. Do you know what Hospitals are going to be forced to do with your Grand mother-father.....with our elderly? Hospitals are going to be placed in a position of refusing to admit Patients that need to be admitted so that they don't get fined. Also if they do get fined that cost is going to be added onto everyon's bill. The cost of Health care has just increased by Trillions of dollars. Why wasn't that in the news yesterday?
DaveFromDanaPointCA.....
I was in the Army Security Agency (now defunct) as a morse intercept operator 61-64. Peacetime, fortunately, and I got out 2 months before the official date of the Vietnam Era which began in August 1964. Always liked the insignia.
I believe with everyone else that we need to change our healthcare system.We need to adopt the French or Canadian system and throw out the crap we have right now.
What Group? The Obama fan club? Seriously are you thinking that Americans are so dumb we can't do the math?
Unfortunately, your posts prove that to be exactly the case.
Not to mention your propensity for hyperbole and mendacity.
Not even there candidate for VP thinks they can do the math. He says it would take too long. lol!
There is only one reason no to want a better health care system... STUPIDITY! The best plan is an improved version of Medicare for all.
Precisely.
The ONLY interest of health insurance companies is PROFIT.
Of course... and besides adding exactly zero benefit to the healthcare system, they actually serve to make it more onerous to get decent health care.
The choice is clear.....
Romneycare was a good idea then and it's still a good choice as Obamacare.
The Republican plan is great if you are wealthy..... period.
If you are poor, under their plan you won't need "death panels" to mark you for death with no affordable health care
you are going to die anyway.
Long live the wealthy Republicans!!!
The Democrats' plan is great if you are poor or illegal. Take a look at states that are facing or near bankruptcy like New York and California..... Democratic states. Don't plan it on the "at one point" Republican Governors because they never stood a chance with the majority being Democrat. Fact: Young and old are leaving New York because they can't afford to live here. Businesses are leaving because they can't afford it.
I can understand why people would want to leave that Sh**hole NY, but please don't come to Florida, we have many more New Yorkers than we will ever need in a lifetime. Go out west, where there is lots of open land and no one has to listen to that New Yawk Whine, that sounds like fingernails on a chalk board.
There are some things you need to understand about RomneyCare:
It does NOT provide universal healthcare. There are still people in MA who cant afford healthcare. The Commonwealth Connector has approved plans with such high deductibles and co-pays that people cant afford to use them to access healthcare. Healthcare bankruptcy is still a problem.
It does not control costs. To preserve RomneyCare the sate has implemented "cost controls" that will lead to waits and shortages.
It's insurance based approach has driven up already high administrative costs
It is difficult to find and get an appointment with a primary care physician
It is not the success that some people would like you to believe.
Didn't the troops see cuts to their pay and medical cuts under Obama?
^ No.
Didn't Obama waste over a billion dollars bombing Libya?
^ Getting rid of Qaddafi is a wasted effort? You do know Qaddafi has killed more Americans than anyone other than Bin Laden don't you? You do know he was going to massacre is own people don't you? Then why is getting rid of him a waste?
And how about all his little drone raids.
^ The one's that have decimated Al Qaeda you mean? How about them? You oppose them? Are you pro Al Qaeda?
BTW: What does this have to do with Mitt Romney's health care plans causing 50 million Americans to lose their insurance and the rest to pay higher prices?
Was your incoherent foreign policy rant supposed to change the subject from Mitt Romney's idiotic health care plans?
Democrat102012,
Even stupider second time around.
Enough with this stuff. Bama's Bamacare will cost Americans way more. The working stiffs, like me, will be paying it and way after I'm gone, future generations. Take a look at what's going on in Europe to realize IT DOESN'T WORK folks. If hospitals wouldn't be forced to care for illegals and every kid they pop out, perhaps right there we would see a reduction in costs to all. It's also a joke to consider an illegal's kid a naturalized citizen when....they were born him under illegal circumstances...hello???? They broke the law!
OH and like Obama care is not going to cost us. Another smoke and mirrors by this news network to make the opposition look bad.
It is already estimated by Obama's own experts that his health care is already twice maybe even 3 times what he said it would cost tax payers.
So his plan can not be any worse than Obama's and maybe just a little bit better.
Any way it goes, the tax payer is the loser in all this. Only the insurance companies come out on top. They will get their money one way or another.
In the words of Lyin' Ryan:
“We're not going to let our campaign be dictated by fact-checkers.”
That's right... Because "It was the Movie"
Obama cant stand "2016" because it tells the truth about his crap ideas.
NBC cant stand the truth being exposed on their lil boy.
Democrats cant stand the truth being exposed on their meal ticket liberal Obama.
Wake up Democrats - you are being used to destroy the USA under the disguise of "new ideas".
There is nothing new about Communisn/ Socialism.
Anyone who has watched 2016 and takes it or touts it as plausible reality needs medical attention.
I'm serious. It's paranoid, delusional and most of all childish.
Sam Lyin ryin we don't let factcheckers run our campaign....enough said.
Vote out these lyin job obstructionist, America haters, they ONLY care about their OWN greed.
Vote Obama/Biden 2012
Unless the government develops a plan to get some control over medical costs, no system will work. The whole thing needs to be overhauled. And for those doctors who have huge college loans, they have to be part of the overhaul. We can't expect anyone to take the entire hit. This country as a whole needs to be involved, and the paper pushers of insurance companies need to be reimbursed even less than that proposal in the ACA. I feel that the insurance companies are just middle management, probably not as needed as our Congress seems to think. This overhaul needs a lot of thinking which the Congress seems unable or unwilling to do. It's very tedious to try to justify unnecessary industry and to try to justify the subsidies awarded them by Congress. Medical companies included.
The AHCA lowers costs for some people and raises costs for others. But it does not solve the issues of health care affordability and only mildly improves access and coverage. The big problem with it, in my opinion, is that it forces people and businesses to buy already costly, chiefly for-profit, health insurance. Which only goes to enrich for-profit insurance companies, medical device makers, drug companies, lawyers, doctors, and nurses.
If we want to make health care more affordable, perhaps we should replace for-profit insurers with non-profit ones, cap malpractice lawsuits, cap specialists' salaries, and limit the cost of drugs.
I'm surprised no one has mention how obama-care has already started to affect their health care. My wife works for a major corporation. She was notified that the company would no longer provide Kaiser, Blue Cross/Blue Shield and one other that I can't remember the name of. They would be given the choice of one provider that I've never heard of and the cost would be triple what she has been paying for family care while she's been with her company. Obama-care is ripping the system apart taking away from what we once enjoyed and costing three times the amount so that a few that didn't want to pay for health care but are now forced to do so against their will. This is what happens when you put a community organizer from Chicago, (that sh!t hole everyone knows about), in charge of the whole United States.
The American people need to slap that ass, obama, right back to where he came from, that sh!it hole Chicago.
Obamacare doesn't start until 2014. It's the general high cost of healthcare that's causing the problems you're mentioning.
Oh well.... The Group said it..
Where do I get my free Obama-Phone?
Its hard for me to see what could be more privatized than the ACO which is essentially a republican idea before Obama adopted it. With the exception of Medicare, The ACA writes the private insurance industry's complete control over the healthcare system into law.
You know I really like those who use the term my employer but never mention the employers name. Don't really know why? While I was employed with the Home Depot, from 2001 to 2010, my health insurance increased every year, I guess by your reasoning they increased it because they were anticipating the passage of the ACA and because of it raised my insurance rates.. Listen insurance companies only look for reasons to raise rates. The bottom line for all of them is there bottom line...
Yes ObamaCare or RomneyCare is the answer to keeping costs down. If that is the case then why did my monthly cost go from just over $400 dollars a month to well over $500 under ObamaCare? The answer is not only the ObmanCare mandate but reform of the entire healthcare system to root out ambulance chasers and the CYA tactics of doctors that go over and above to try and prevent suits.
We also need to address the illegals that do not pay anything for healthcare because they are judgment proof that go to the ER that is much costlier than regular care and get charity care that the entire health care system pays for.
We may have the best medicine that money can buy at the top end but we deliver less for more on the average health services provided.
The Affordable Healthcare Act does not take effect until 2014, Greg E, and RomneyCare will raise healthcare costs significantly. Read the article before commenting. Your last sentence is right on. The answer lies in the average healthcare company CEO in 2011 made $10.8 million in compensation.
Hitobito,
Obamacare will cost about 1 trillion dollars a year. Romneycare costs practically nothing. It is already proven in Massachusetts.
MSNBC is starting another propaganda against Romney.
Romney is a TOOL, and I suspect you may be as well. Privatization DOES NOT WORK!!! EVER!!!!!!