It was a bit more than an annoyance! Had H1N1 in Sept 2010. Flu became pneumonia wthin the first 48-hours, was in hospital for three weeks and off work for 3 months after. It was a futher 6-months until I was completely well. It was really scary and financially devestating. I hope never to have influenza again. Not at all surprised that so many died.

Someone brought that stuff in at work, and in a week's time, we all had it (Big Place). That was some "Killer Stuff". I had it for about four weeks, and my body was ran down for a three months. Hope I never get it again. They think H1N1 was related to the 1918 outbreak that killed between 50-100 million people worldwide. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swine_influenza

284,500 is a drop in a bucket

Wow, just wow. You exhibit a severe lack of compassion.

It's only a drop in the bucket if it doesn't affect you. If you catch, then it's different.

My sisters sister in law died from H1N1---so very sad. I was a medical researcher I hate a lot of the things big pharm does ( like the rotovirus vaccine--no one in the u.s dies of rotovirus) However I really appreciate all the time and energy that scientist on the front line are doing to track this virus. This is what big pharm should be about NOT filling our kids with vaccines we don't need.

Big pharms don't fill kids with vaccines they don't need,liberal politicians do!

Jonathan--Go back to FOX where there are really big stories like WMD's and whole countries we could eradicate with our own WMD's, or medical death squads in the present Administration. Try not to bother with thoughtful, intelligent and useful information.

A friend died this year of pneumonia; she was not elderly.

The annoyance is people that do not consider other people worth saving. What else do you want to spend your money on, your tan?

I am in complete agreement!

there IS in fact a reason why scientists "freak out" with every new flu virus

we don't have a good vaccine

flu virus' are highly contageous

because of factory farming of pigs and chickens especially.. a resevoir of flu virus' that jump to peopple....and close intereatction between those animals and humans especially in developing co countries(chickents) new flu combinations are popping up all the time at an accelerated rate

If you understood the biology of flu you'd understand the urgency. Human manipulations of animals in huge numbers not found naturally makes resevoirs for disease that adapts quickly to humans and change quickly

There are strains that kill hafl or more of all people they infect. It's Russian roulette whether or not that strain will, and when or if (if seems less likely now to scientists) combine with other flues

we don't have ANy other flu pandemics that happened with MODERN SCIENCE and molecular biology immunology genetics (ie in the last fifteen yrs). Around this last pandemic science was learning in real time and sharing what they thought in the moment

it ended up confusing people who thought science should have been more definitive.

This is science happening in real time...the last pandemic was an experiment on the world and they are anaylsing the data now so they can learn for the future.

I ask the patients of people like you. There are LEGIT reasons that when NEW flu pops up it could ge dantgerous until they know what it is.

There is no such thing as a "vaccine" for viral infections. The term "Vaccine" would lead one to believe it will keep them from getting sick. It won't. It may lessen the effects of the virus, but there is no concrete evidence of that. You cannot successfully vaccinate anyone against a virus. Period. The pharmicutical companies stand to make HUGE profits from their "vaccines" which they sell to the federal government to vaccinate young, old, elderly, sick, and anyone else they can inject. If you remember correctly, the H1N1 vaccine was in "short supply" until all of a sudden, the government had enough to vaccinate every person in America. It bogus. Some people catch the flu and get very sick. Some people catch it and have mild symtpoms. Other people catch it and die. And this happens even if you get the vaccine. Explainations anyone?

Well yes there is a vaccine for viral infections and there IS concrete evidence that these can either prevent a person from catching the virus; or, that should they contact the virus, lessen its effects. You don't just get to make up your facts. Sheesh!

Got news for you people that swear by flu vaccines. They're only good for LAST year's strains. A killer bug like H1N1 will never be stopped by vaccines because they can't make a vaccine until the bug first appears. It's not a lack of compassion but cold hard facts that 284,500 is NOTHING compared to manmade causes of death. When we get a virus that wipes out 50 to 70 percent of the world, maybe I'll take notice. Most likely I'll be dead but that's life.

My husband and I have been trying for years to have a baby and were thrilled when it finally happened. I began stockpiling supplies,decorating the room, reading all the books.....I contracted H1N1 (foolishly thought the flu shot protected me) while pregnant in 2010. Unfortunately, after over two weeks of being bedridden with illness and trying desperately to care for myself, I lost my almost 16 week old fetus. S/he was my much,much wanted baby. Yes, 285K is a drop in the bucket, but when that drop in the bucket was loved by you, it's water torture. It's life, but it is still tragic.

@ Jonathan Reid. I was hospitalized with that "drop in the bucket" swine flu for a week at Christmas. Can't describe how difficult it was to breathe. Was pretty sure that it was going to be my time to go. My 19 yr. old daughter sat by my side the entire time , 24 hrs. every day. It was too difficult for my younger son. I will never forget the look on her face. Her friend, lost her father to it the following week. I will pray however, that you never contract something as horrendous as this "drop in the bucket."

Is this the start of the sales push for the vaccine that will prevent this winters scary flu? Twice I've gotten the vaccine du-jour and twice Ive been bedridden because of it.

Please feel free to accuse me of not supporting pharmaceutical profits but I'll pass. Thanks.

@Jonathan--How many hundreds of thousands of people should die before you would consider it worthwhile for researchers and CDC to "freak out", as you put it?

See Tommy Lee's post--The population of the planet was a lot less than it is now when that 1918-19 worldwide pandemic killed so many--est. to be between 50million and 100million. If that were the proportion of the number of deaths, based on today's world population--we're talking about over 500million--that's half a billion. Would that number be big enough for you to get excited about? Geez.

According to the CDC, up to 52,000 people die annually from the flu (not swine-specific) in the US. If you look at the numbers only, in a world of 7 BILLION people, a loss of 285,000 is not overly significant. Last year it was predicted that 572,000 people in the US alone would die from cancer. I don't have the figure for world wide. From a solely statistical viewpoint, 285k is not a huge number. Now, from a humanitarian perspective one death is too much. With every disease, especially something relatively new on the scene, more people are going to get it worse but you need to realize that many people who contracted the swine flu were relatively fine. I caught it and was truly down for about 2 days, over the worst of it and functional within 4. My family never caught it. The same is true for many people I know. The simple fact is that they don't have any idea how many people actually had it, and what the actual death rate was. If you recall, in the US we were advised NOT to go to the dr unless there were complications, and it wasn't until further into the cycle that they began testing everyone who may have had it. The death rate from it may have been 5% or 50% - no one has any way to determine that. Now, most people have already been exposed to it and should have natural defenses against it, making it a bit of a non-issue.

and to increase the public's awareness of the importance of influenza prevention,” said lead author Fatimah Dawood, a CDC epidemiologist.

Setting the stage for another pandemic necessary for big pharma to grow.

152K to 575K is about a four-fold difference. With such "close" estimating it is no wonder they were considered inaccurate. These numbers are to support the "need" to have more vaccine available and to scare more people into getting indoctrinated - er, inoculated.

What most of you are not understanding is there is a specific number the CDC goes by when it comes to pathogens. That's the mortality rate. So 250,000 people die from the swine flu - how many total people contracted it? If 500,000 had it then the mortality rate is 50% - that's bad. However, you also have to take into consideration how many of those people were immune-compromised or had other medical conditions making them less able to fight the infection. Now the number starts dropping. Something like Bubonic Plague has a mortality rate of ~70%, Swine Flu is much much less than that.

Now when you start seeing that 10+ million people contracted H1N1 and only 250,000 died the mortality rate drops even further to only 2.5%. Of course MSN failed to list the actual infection rates so as to sensationalize a non-story.

Furthermore, the majority of deaths were in Asia. There are a lot of rural areas there which have no access to proper medical care if any at all. Most other places are so highly populated it creates unsanitary conditions which means most of those people probably had malnutrition and/or a prior infection on top of the flu.

Yes, even one person dying from a disease is significant if the one person is you or someone you love. However, try looking at the big picture for a second and don't blow a non-issue out of proportion. 250,000 is nothing and at 7 billion people we seem to be doing a pretty good job on "no human dies".

OK people - Let's take a breath and look at this objectively.

First off - The money "Big Pharma" makes on vaccines is truly a "drop in the bucket". They can make far more money off the medications they make treating the illnesses that the vaccines prevent. If you stop and really think about it you'd realize that your argument that vaccines are some sort of money making conspiracy doesn't make any logical sense. In fact the reason there are periodic vaccine shortages is because many pharmaceutical companies have stopped making vaccine because it's not cost effective. Vaccine manufacture is pretty much viewed by the industry as altruistic.

Secondly - It is irresponisble for the CDC and medical community to ignore a potential life threatening new disease simply because it doesn't kill as many people as cancer. There are treatments that when given early enough in the course of the illness can dramatically improve the duration and severity of symptoms. There are also many people who have chronic conditions that can be highly complicated by flu, particularly a virulent strain, such as Asthma, COPD, children with Neurological disorders, etc. It is important for doctors to know who is most likely to be at high risk for complications and the best way to treat those complications in order to prevent avoidable hospitalizations and deaths. That is the purpose of the CDC "freaking out" - to keep those numbers as low as possible.

Lastly - When you hear a report about a new bug that's making the rounds, there is no need to panic. Chances are if you are a healthy person and you catch a bad bug you will be fine. Listen to the reccomendations of the CDC. Practice good flu season hygeine. Teach your children to sneeze, cough,etc into a tissue. Wash your hands frequently and avoid areas of high concetrations of people with poor ventilation/cleanliness whenever possible. Keep hand sanitzer/sanitizing wipes in your car or office and in your handbag so you always have a way to clean your hands and make it a habit to do so throughout the day. Unless you have a sensitivity or other containdication, get yourself vaccinated. No preventative measure is 100% effective, but vaccines do work to help contain the spread of the virus. Yes you might run a low temp for a day or two afterwards and feel a little achey, but it does save lives. You only need to look at the disease transmission numbers where vaccination rates are good versus those in areas with poor vaccination to see the difference.

@Kallie,

You're wrong about "rotovirus" (sic). It is rotavirus. And it is the leading cause of death in infants except for malnutrition in the world. And it is, even in the United States, still the major reason for hospitalization of infants. "In the United States, before initiation of the rotavirus vaccination program, rotavirus caused about 2.7 million cases of severe gastroenteritis in children, almost 60,000 hospitalizations, and around 37 deaths each year." Rotavirus is still a very serious illness in the US and is still killing infants, especially among the children of vaccine-averse parents. In the developing world, it is about 2 million a year who are hospitalized or become severely ill, and about 450,000 who die. Tell those parents about why rotavirus vaccine is a bad idea.

The for-profit hospital industry and the American Pediatric Association have long opposed the rotavirus vaccine because rotavirus infections among infants are a very lucrative TREATABLE disease. And American physicians are mal-trained to TREAT in preference to PREVENT.

Didja notice that the AMA just came out against the recommendation that all patients be screened for obesity? Same difference --- obesity is a very lucrative revenue stream and is highly TREATABLE even though it is entirely PREVENTABLE.

It sounds like a lot, but 250,000 - 500,000 people die from the flu every year. Yes, many deaths were caused by this specific strain, but how were the overall flu-deaths affected?

We don't need more vaccines, we need humane treatment and healthy living conditions for farm animals raised for food. This will this enrich their "short lives", do away with all the many hormones and toxic inoculations required now to fight off diseases resulting from squalid living conditions and their "amp'ed up" rate of growth and size. In the end, it'll give those that eat meat--real meat. Not hormone-laded, toxic genetically engineered crap!

Have you ever watched, "Farm to Fridge"? If you haven't, I suggest you try to view as much of that video as you can stomach. The video will show the grotesque and inhuman treatment and squalid living conditions farm animals are abused by and forced to live in; crammed into containers with no room to even turn around in, standing in their own excrement, blood and other waste.

Pigs, cows, chickens, turkeys all shot up full of hormones and other toxins to battle-off diseases caused by the unhealthy living conditions. The farm animals who get sick will vomit, get diarrhea and wallow literally in their own $hit and other bodily waste. Pigs eat anything--they eat "Pig". Its the same with chickens, cows--all farm animals raised for our consumption. This contributes to mad cow disease, avian flu, and swine flu.

So then what we get is "Big Pharma" to the rescue (and to make those "Big Bucks.") More vaccines. Did you know that in the late 1950's, only 5 vaccines were required for kids. Today it's 14 (15 if you make your daughters get the HPV.)

Now H5N1? That's going to take a lot of "special eggs." Can you say, "Genetically Engineered"?

Read, "Vaccine A" by Gary Matsumoto.

Swine Flu? Avian Flu? Mad Cow Disease? Watch Farm to Fridge video. Check out how cruel and inhuman "farm animals raised for consumption" are treated. See how they're raised in the squalid conditions they are forced to live in. (I'm using the word, "live" quite loosely." They have no life.

Then we have people like, Steve King (R-IA); the congressman who bragged about his bill to "do away with animal rights."

In the words of Temple Grandin: "Farm animals are raised for our consumption; we owe them our respect."

We don't need more vaccines, we need humane treatment and healthy living conditions for farm animals. Healthy farm animals--not one's chock-ful-a hormones and toxic genetically engineered crap.

Wonder why your bones ache in the morning? Cancer? Rheumatoid Arthritis? Asthma? Over weight? Lack of energy and a host of other ailments you're taking pills for? Watch "Food Matters"; "Forks over Knifes"; Farm to Fridge."

Stop eating Fast Food. Limit you meat intake. Research and read.

CDC alarmist "without e

they evaluated the facts as thewy were available in real time.

it looked like numerous young people were dying at a high rate in Mexico City

What they didn't know is that adults over 30 had some immunity because of previous exposures to part of the new virus. That is why old people didn'5 catch it much

yet the older you were if you got it the more likly you were to die. It was more severe then usual flu in people who did not have partial immunity. Healhy fit people ended up in hospital and worse way more often then expected...especially teens and 20s

Nice. You read a headline saying "Swine Flu far deadlier", then open it to see a recap of the 2009-2010 swine flu. 3 years old. Tricky msn. Vewwy vewwy twicky.

Good god man, are you really that stupid?

One day, the flu will kill you. Old people are more vulnerable.

Everybody dies, it's just a matter of when and where. And 284,500 people out of 7 billion isn't even a drop in the bucket. Just remember nobody gets out of here alive.

Yes, but there's no need to speed your departure. That's a dumb argument. I hear the same thing form smokers. " Got to die of something." Yes, but if I have a choice, it won't be from preventable respiratory distress. Drowning in your own secretions is not the way to go.

Good for you. More people should do the same.

Totally botched time sorry you went thru that

however that was 36 yrs ago. Science of all things has changed profoundly since them

MOSt flus that jump to human are "swine flu" (unless they are bird)...it is not a narrow catagory. All swine flus are not related (just the animal that was infected first is)

they know why that vaccine made some people sick.The techniques for makinig vaccine now is totally different.

Every year seasonal flu vaccine is given to millions safely. Side effect profine very good. Vaccines for epidemic and pandemic flus are made the same way as the seasonal flu vaccine...exactly the same way.

very safe. Especially compared to other vaccines. Tested and proven each yr

Stephen not everyone is a fatalist. Let's see you keep that attitude if someone you know, God forbid someone in your family, dies from the flu. It may just change your tune. I hate people that are arrogant about these kinds of things, it is uncalled for.

At first my Dr. tried to tell me I just had the Flu, BS. I think most people that had H1N1 and not influenza realize how lucky they were. MusicGirl23, I don't know ANYONE who had H1N1 and felt they had little more than a cold, you could'nt get rid of it and you could catch it again. Like a "Leech" sucks the life out of you.

They aren't covering up anything. Amazing how people love to make up conspiracy theories. We were very lucky with the Swine Flu pandemic this time in that it was not a very virulent form. That may not be the case next time. The virus still killed a lot of people. The great fear is that the next pandemic will be like the Spanish Flu of 1918, which was both virulent and highly contagious. In that year, millions died worldwide. The flu spread rapidly around the world even though travel was primitive by today's standards. A person crossing the Atlantic would be on a ship for a couple of weeks, instead of several hours on an airplane. And the population was a fraction of what it is today. A bug as bad as the 1918 strain would cause unbelievable catastrophe today. We really aren't much better at treating influenza today than we were then. The weapon we have today is vaccines, and we have big problems getting the right ones out there in time.

Old Sarge: The reason those people don't care about it is that they don't care if anybody lives or dies. That in itself is an epidemic that I would love to be able to stop, because it can lead to wars, dictatorships, and just plain meanness that drains everybody.

They also don't realize that an epidemic must be stopped before it becomes too big to stop. It's like cancer; just a wee little bit might not be so bad, but it's going to multiply quickly to invade organs and cause death. The Plague of 1346 took about half of Europe, and quickly. No "advances in medicine" may be able to stop something that the world hasn't seen before.

The World Health Organization estimates that the annual global death toll for flu is between 240 - 500K. So, this horific pandemic was about average. Numbers from there web site.

I disagree, here

all that you say is out there somewhat except there is only indirect evidence and it's debated that "most poeple only felt like they had a cold"

you mistate 'most people developed an immunity" but I think I know what you mean. It turned out that most adults over thrity had some immunity because they'd been exposed to some other virus in the past that shared components to this current flu. So people went into this pandemic WITH some immunity. You can't fault science for NOT KNOWING THAT. You can't know until you analayse data after the fact.

but this is the new information...,more people got sick then they thought

Thanks Old Sarge and Laurali--wish more people would post based on evidence, rather than their version of reality.

The 1918-19 flu epidemic, I've read, is likely related to an avian flu. At the time, they didn't even have enough medical knowledge to see the necessity of quarantining people who were sick. Close quarters (eg, young people in the military service on ships bound for Europe) made a very strong strain of influenza spread even more rapidly--among an otherwise hale and hearty population. A flu that kills a disproportionately high number of the young and healthy versus the victims who are in frail health and elderly and might be susceptible to many types of infections--not just the flu--yes, that is cause for alarm. My own grandmother lost her older sister and her younger sister in the 1918-19 Spanish flu pandemic.

Old Sarge - you obviously weren't NBC. Petrol specialist, maybe?

To talk as though you have any knowledge on the workings of a pandemic, epidemic, or any type of illness is just moronic and you as an NCO should know not to spread false statements and spread false information.

The spanish flu was deadly because it was a relatively new virus to most parts of the world. No one had immunity to it, most people at the time would have been better of contracting Bubonic Plague since a lot of us are the offspring of the survivors from the plague outbreak in Europe.

Furthermore, there was no modern medical care or medicine back then. No knowledge on how to combat the virus. They barely even knew that viruses existed - they were all 'germs'. Also, there were plenty of crowded areas that helped the virus spread quickly from person to person. WWI was ending but still being fought so all those soldiers packed like sardines in barracks and trains didn't help. Lets not forget that them traveling to other countries gave the virus an even larger infection zone. Cross country travel helped spread the disease even quicker in the US and once it reached largely populated areas it was game over.

Seems you need to adjust fire before continuing along your current course of action less you look even more uninformed.

Vaccinations are tested. Sorry to inform you, but many elderly are saved by the pneumonia shot.

I had a friend who died this year of pneumonia; I wish she had had the shot, she wasn't that old.

Please keep your tin foil for your turkey.

Thank you for the heads up.

Unfortunately as a Military Medic for 15 years I have seen more damage to soldiers from immunizations than protected them.

I don't get the flu shot anymore and I'm still healthy after 7 years.

That said, Disease like the Flu and Pneumonia is natures way of thinning the heard.

If you ever studied then you would find that even though the Black Plague decimated Europe that some did survive with no vaccinations.

The reason why I mention this is because Nature was doing it's thing. Yes people died, well, that's what happens to people and nothing you or I can do about it. In the Plague's case the Strongest gene's survived and the rest went bye bye.

Premature babies SHOULD be allowed to just pass naturally. Allowing the strongest and healthiest to survive. Anything less taints the gene pool and that goes for Little Water Head Kyle who is allergic to peanuts and his soccer mom nobody has the school change the lunch menu.

Awww, am I just a cruel ahole....

My Aunt is 101 and can still move on her own so I guess I have a good set of genes while poor Kyle has a lifetime of health problems and drops dead from diabetes after spending his short life obese and on a scooter at Walmart.

Truth stings doesn't it!

Too bad bad spelling wasn't another way to "thin the HERD." Mary Ann. I seriously doubt you were a military medic for 15 years or 15 days if you make a statement like your first one. I got god knows how many immunizations when I enlisted and went through MEPS, as did about 300 other guys, had one with an immediate allergic reaction, and that was it. Pretty sure the shots kept the rest of us healthy and safe from all the virus and contagions that are typically found when you have lots of people from disparate backgrounds all jammed together in basic training conditions.

I have to agree with Mary ann, if Nature didn't come up with diseases to keep the population of animals and people in check, imagine how overrun the earth would be! I think it's horrible for anyone to contract a deadly disease, but I think certain ones pop up to keep our species under some kind of control. Just wondering!

I'll have to toss my vote to Mary Ann. As the planet becomes more and more populated - that means more and more waste products, etc. And sooner or later - the bacteria that truly own and run this rock will level the playing field again. And again.

Only humans are too stupid to get it.......... like those over breeders (Duggans?) in Arkansas!

Wrong there Don,

I went through when they were still using the immunization Gun.

Do tell on about your experiences...

I can tell you about untested pills given to us at the beginning of the Gulf War that was supposed to immunize us from Nerve Agent but just seem to make everyone sick.

That the airgun thing where they stitch you up and down both arms? That is what I experienced, have to say, I still think you are way off base and have to doubt you were any type of a medic in any of the US services, but hey, doubt makes the world go 'round I guess.

If there is a disease that only kills stupid people. Mary Ann will be the first to go.

Mary Ann--Wow. Just wow. You definitely possess a great deal of scientific knowledge gathered from first-hand experience. So, I can understand your doubtfulness about forced vaccine programs--but as to the rest of your discourse--"thinning the herd"? And, who brought up anything about comparing this to letting premature babies "pass naturally"? Please don't try to dictate to parents of premature infants that efforts should not be made to save their child. There are many cases where a premature infant who received adequate care developed into a child healthy enough to keep up with their peers--and whom you would never suspect was originally a "preemie." That's very nearly what some 20th century despots were preaching. And, both those remark sounded a bit arrogant in referring to your fellow human beings. "Eugenics" anyone?

My husband and his co-workers spent New Year's Eve of 2000 at work. He had sent thousands of pages of code around for various people to fix; they were still getting after people to actually do it up to the end. All went smoothly, and everybody said "big deal." Well, we all got our surprise on 9/11/2001, didn't we? Somebody at the top hadn't done their homework after all, and had been on vacation most of the year. But at least Y2K was averted.

There is a little known fact about Y2K: at my husband's place of work, the code was actually fixed. But many companies said, well, there are going to be different computers in a few years, so they just forwarded the date to 2030 or so. But by then, there won't be the old programmers who were all taught machine code, and nobody will know why so many computers are suddenly down.

The only thing Y2k did was scare people and sell books.

If you honestly thought you made a difference...well You didn't.

My profession is medical but I have worked on TI Mainframes and every personal computer since 1977. Believe me when I reiterate...You made no difference and your work fell into the just in case category.

I was also working for a company that re-mediated potential Y2K issues in 1999. Mary Ann, you may not believe that there would have been major issues, but you're dead wrong. We found many industrial manufacturing systems that would have malfunctioned after the turn of the century, mostly related to data logging such as alarms and batch data. This isn't a guess, we tested the systems by setting the dates forward and voila.....failure.

Even with all the effort that was expended, some issues still occurred. However, in these cases, the companies routinely covered them up to avoid the embarrassment.

Just because you didn't find any issues doesn't mean there weren't any.

Believe me when I reiterate.....you're dead wrong.

But, Bosco -

The world Health Organiation indicates on their web site that the average annual death toll for common "flu" world wide is 240 - 500K. So the numbers cited in the article (which was for 18 months) are not out of the norm. I doubt most of the world was vaccinated - it was in short supply here, as I recall.

mpa

most people who die in developed countries of the flu are the old and sick. by far. it rarely kills young and middle aged healthy people...even in developing countries, if they are well nourished.

The thing with this flui is WHO it killed...young healthy people disproportionately and NOT the elderly. That shows the relative killing strength of this virus. It didn't kill the elderly simply because they had remaining immunity from past infections inside them

IF they had not but the virus was the same, it is not hard to see that millions would have died...all those young people plus the middle aged and old with no immunity

its just luck that when this virus reassorted from it's various parts one or some was a part middle age and older people's immune systems had seen before.

Laurali -

I don't disagree with a thing you've stated, but I can't buy that this was a horific pandemiic based on the numbers.

Also, Bosco stated: "To all the people saying that the flu epidemic wasn't really that bad...That's BECAUSE the CDC scared the bejesus out of people so they'd get the vaccination and a lot of people did. So, because more people were vaccinated there wasn't as big of an outbreak. See how that works."

His statement might have validity vis-a-vis the US, but the great majority of the people in the world didn't get the vaccine, and the numbers were still not higher than routine flu epidemics.

Laurali, your arguement makes sense but you don't carry it far enough. Yes, most elderly citizens had some immunity from the flu because they had already been exposed to it. That is absolutely true and that is nature working as it should. However, by promoting vaccines (not swine specific) for younger, healthy generations, are we not limiting the exposure to different viruses and minimizing our bodies ability to develop a natural immunity?

I guess a lot of you have forgotten the endless jokes about the deadly swine flu. The message boards, papers and comics had a roll with it simply because after being told we would all die from this thing, many people either didn't catch it or barely got ill from it. It is tragic that anyone died from it, but it was no worse than any other flu in regards to fatality.

Mary Ann, if you were collecting unemployment in New York not a single check would have gone out after 1/1/2000. Or should I say 1/1/1900? Because that's what every program would have thought the date was. Space requirements in the early days of computing made them use a 2 digit date instead of 4. Simple logic would tell you that anything based on a date would fail. We may not have had the power grid failures and accidental missile launches that some would like you to think could happen but it would have been an accounting nightmare.

Interesting Bosco66, I didn't get the vaccine - in fact a lot of people didn't. Guess what? We're still here. See how that works?

The vaccine was pointless and sensationalism. Nothing more.

That's super that you have a working knowledge of computers. So do I. However, I also have a working knowledge of pathogens, the human body, epidemiology, and pandemics. See, I was basically NBC in the military then I reclassed to a medic. I then went to school to become a pathologist where I decided to switch majors to network security.

That's great that you feel that you saved the world from Y2K but the rest of us laugh at you. Most systems would have been fine, they would have kept on running like they normally do. The dates would be off - big deal. More work for everyone but that's it. Planes wouldn't fall out of the sky, nuclear power plants wouldn't shut down or have meltdowns. Life support equipment would have still worked along with traffic lights and such. Now if you work for a bank or some accounting company there might have been a problem, I'll give you that. Then again, from the news and the state of our country I'd say you could have done everyone more service by botching a couple lines of code so it failed anyway.

Most places use Windows anyway and if I remember correctly - Microsoft put out the update to "prevent" Y2K. All you had to do was push it to every other machine on the network. Unless you were on a custom Linux build or proprietary software. Keep thinking you saved the world though. My computer did just fine without you, as did everyone else's.

thats funny!

wakani ...........WOW, what was in that shot you got, must have been the good stuff that the rest of us can not afford, if you truly believe what you just said.

All Obama did was help ruin health care more than the health care system did on their own power, more people going to be without health care than every before. But then again maybe you like your 26 year old kids still living off you.

Do tell hal. How did President Obama ruin healthcare? Or even help ruin healthcare? Insurance companies have ruined healthcare in America, and helped raise costs incredibly. Have to admit, I do not know how to cure what ails us at this point, we are so dependent on health insurance companies now, and not because that is where our bills go before we get them either, but because there are millions of Americans employed by health insurance companies, imagine if you will, what would happen if we really went to single payor system and suddenly, suddenly all those health insurance workers were without a job. That would be devastation of the highest order in this country.

But no, President Obama has not ruined health care in America, he has on the other hand, taken a small step towards fixing what is broken, sadly though, it was a terribly small baby step towards an actual solution.

Wait! So Barry fixed the Y2K issue also? Awesome, dude!

nature of science...it evolves, not random

if you had time they could explain why they were wrong before and revised the figures, they always do explain

finally, one thing not clear to most people...that past pandemic was like an experimenrt nature ran. Modern science has not seen a flu pandemic. Science changes so fast this was the first one they could analyse in depth in some ways. They didn' t know what they didn't know so reported things and changed them over much which lost he publics trust sadly

they were learning in real time. when someone learns they know more later than earlier. That's why I'd trust later numbers. It' s not random, they have no motivation to do that.

they are not fools but their communications over the course of this pandemic made people uncertain and untrustworthy of them. The didn' t know they didn't know stuff.

all you can trust is that any pronouncement in a reputable and clear source (not alwasy MSNbc...not clear) by reputable scientists is the best they know in that moment

Laurali -

And your last sentence there is a good argument for not quickly forming public policy because some scentist(s) say so.

Are you old enough to remember when we had 9 planets in the solar system? They voted one out, ya know?

Actually Pluto only got half voted out; it's considered a dwarf planet. Which is not relevant to the topic. Sorry!

Shilodance--Ba da bing!

I am very glad that you truly believe what you wrote....but there is no way you can tell if the shot stopped you from getting pneumonia or not. 24 years in health care and I can tell you there is NO way knowing and No way of proving who it stops from getting sick,

It is one big money making scheme, bottom line, all you did is add money to their cash cow. All they did is push the number around to make it look good for their buddies in the drug business and a kickback for themselves.

You just keep getting those flu shots and pneumonia shots, been MORE die from getting them than they stopped from getting sick...those numbers you never see posted.....but they do exist.....try looking them up littleI56....they will scare the H+ll out of you. People need to look into these things not just blind faith of the Doctors on the payroll.

Like how you figure your going to die with the same things as jim henson....pick any disease you want, and know you will NOT be the only one that year to die of it........going to have lots of company no matter which one you choose. But the drug companies will love you they are planning their vacations already on you and others who they managed to scare to death........

disagree

less people die from flu and pneumonia shots because they prevent those illnesses

they save lives

you are wrong

Laurali, now come on. Yes it is very possible that the flu and pneumonia shots do HELP prevent those illnesses, but if they were as effective as you are trying to portray, no one who ever got the shots would get either condition. We know that to be untrue.

Jupiter -

Some 'news' released the other day indicates the Z-Pak has one nasty side effect - death. No more for me!

What the hell are you talking about? Flu vaccinations are absolutely necessary for older people and people living in a crowd area such as a nursing home. If no vaccinations in nursing homes, old people would die by the truck load when the flu hits and spread like wild fire.

God Robbie, don't try to confuse idiots with common sense.

But when you actually take into account everything you interact with on a daily basis, from opening restroom doors and picking up a newspaper, there is NO WAY possible you can live your life without some type of "contact residue", either from the manufacturer of whatever you buy to a co-worker that picks up a pen in a box and puts it back. And lets not even get to keyboards or office furniture. You would have to live in a bubble and sterilize everything you bought!!!

@Robert:

Common sense is quite remarkable! :-)

Grocery shopping carts are an excellent example, and the mind-boggling aspect is that most shoppers put fresh fruit and vegetables in the part of the shopping cart where infants and toddlers wearing diapers sit, and then they go home and start eating the fresh fruit without washing it, which in the microscopic universe is equivalent to licking the diapers of a virtual festival of infants and toddlers . . .

The way things work with bacteria, prions, and viruses, as well as parasites and other larger disease vectors, is exemplified by the mechanics of tuberculosis bacteria, where it only requires 5 to 10 bacilli of tuberculosis bacteria to infect a human when the 5 to 10 bacilli are inhaled deeply into the lungs, and for reference 5 to 10 bacilli of tuberculosis bacteria will fit into an space approximately the size of a single 5 micron diameter droplet of fog, where to put this into perspective a sufficient quantity of such 5-micron diameter droplets of fog to infect every person on this planet will fit into the rotating canister of a standard concrete mixing truck, which is 8 cubic yards by volume and is approximately half the volume of a walk-in closet that is 6' wide, 10' long, 8' high, really . . .

Really! :-o

P. S. It is vastly important not to touch your eyes, nose, and mouth when venturing into public places, and this also is the case with breathing when it is likely that there are communicable airborne bacteria, prions, and viruses, where using the tuberculosis example a typical cough or sneeze propels a virtual festival of 5-micron diameter droplets of sputum as far as perhaps 10 or so feet, where the "fog" lingers in the air for a while, with singing being the most powerful dispersant of such "fog", which is a good reason to keep a fully enclosed biohazard suit with an independent positive pressure air supply handy for those times when roaming choirs of people who have active tuberculosis knock on your door and want to serenade you with a few bars "Fever" (Peggy Lee) . . .

You give me fever
When you kiss me
Fever when you hold me tight
Fever in the morning
Fever all through the night

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X7_k_0dKknA

Although your cut and paste text is interesting, it is flawed in MANY places and is nothing more than Theory at this point, sadly, since you have produced absolutely, positively, not one shred of proof to your babbling dichotomy.

And FYI, your last paragraph. No one can predict the future. It is the future, it has not happened yet. There are endless timelines and uncertainties between point A - B. You may plan a trip to the store which is a block from your house so you predict that you will go there and have bread back at your house withing 30 minutes. Now, think of all the possible permutations to that certainty, all the possibilities and characteristics for "free will". Maybe you will get chased by a dog, get stopped by friends and end up on a diverted adventure, or maybe you will remember you have bread and turn and go home. Who knows. The future is the FUTURE. It has not happened yet. All predictions, unless strictly enforced and enslaved to its projected path, are conditional and dependent on luck, chance, or just blind faith.

And also, what you classify as Neanderthals are also classified as individuals with some undeveloped brain functionality. My friend had a son that was severely Autistic. You would probably put him in that classification since he rarely slept, made grunting noises, pounded on the walls, and the like. But it had nothing to do with him being a throw-back to early man, and everything to do with a deformity. The creation of life is one of the most mystifying and amazing feats on the face of this planet. And one that sometimes, does not give us the results we expect.