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Subscribe to RSSCould Jerry Sandusky have a psychiatric condition that helps explain the alleged acts of sexual abuse he's currently on trial for? That's what the defense for the former Penn State assistant football coach intends to argue, according to court documents released today.
Prosecutors have argued that letters Sandusky wrote to multiple young boys are proof of "grooming behavior" -- something pedophiles do that might include giving kids presents or acting nicely toward the child to establish an intimate relationship. Over time, it can make the child feel like he or she "owes" the predator sexual acts. The defense intends to argue that these letters exhibit signs of a histrionic personality disorder, a psychiatric condition in which people act in overly emotional and dramatic ways in order to draw attention to themselves.
The defense may or may not succeed in arguing that an undiagnosed personality disorder explains the letters, but when it comes to the case as a whole, the psychiatric issue is irrelevant, says Dr. Liza Gold, clinical prof of psychology at Georgetown University.
"This really has nothing to do with whether he molested boys," says Gold, who stresses that she has not examined Sandusky herself.
"There's no evidence that I know of that links personality disorder to pedophilia," she says. Some pedophiles may have a personality disorder, and some with a personality disorder may be pedophiles. But there's no correlation between the two, argues Gold, who also serves as the vice president of the American Academy of Psychiatry and the Law. "It's apples and oranges. It's not even apples and oranges; it's apples and rocks."
People with histrionic personality disorder often need to feel like they're the center of attention, and they tend to seek endless reassurances and approval from others. They may believe a relationship is more intimate than it actually is, and they may act in inappropriately seductive ways toward other people. One hint of the disorder may be a string of failed romantic relationships or a history of many job changes -- and while that's not the case in all with the condition, it's worth noting that Sandusky has been married to the same woman since the late '60s, and he spent almost his entire three-decade career as an assistant coach at Penn State.
To diagnose a person with the disorder, a psychologist will consider his or her current and past patterns of behavior and overall psychiatric history, and compare them with the current definition of histrionic personality disorder according to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, usually referred to as the DSM.
It's true that the defense could have evidence of a previous psychiatric history that hasn't been made public. But as Gold says, it's not uncommon for a person in legal trouble to claim they have a psychiatric disorder of some kind. She adds that it would be unusual for an older man to be diagnosed with the personality disorder late in life, especially because the condition is more common in women.
"Even if he has a personality disorder, it would not, to my mind, explain any kind of behavior involving child abuse and inappropriate relationships with children," Gold reiterates.
"I think the money question is, So he has a histrionic personality disorder. So what?" she continues. "You have to show that there's some relationship to the behavior at issue. And the behavior at issue isn't writing some letters to some kids; the behavior at issue here is pedophilia."
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Could former Jerry Sandusky.... Did the slimeball change his name? :-)
Tourette's syndrome is a disorder that makes you do things you do not want to. You have no choice. Even if you don't want to do an act you are compelled and unable to do otherwise. There are many disorders that compell people to do things they know to be wrong. Do not try and separate one from the other.
If you are depressed then just don't be right? Too bad it doesn't work that way.
No it doesn't matter! I have GREATER-THAN-THOUISM and I am a Presidential Candidate!
pullmyfinger13: #1, they aren't arguing Tourette's. #2, even if they were, it wouldn't be an excuse for a pattern of sustained behavior of seeking children and molesting them for a prolonged period of time.
I've suffered from depression. I know it's not something you can control. However, while I couldn't control my feelings, I could control how I chose to act on them.
They're not saying he's psychotic. The disorder they're claiming is not one where the person has no control over their choice of behavior.
So his defense is hes not normal like REGULAR CHILD MOLESTERS? Pull my finger, you and people like you are clueless.
It might matter & it might not; the judge wisely determined that this was a matter for the jury to decide. Mr. Sandusky was not schizophrenic, did not suffer from any debility that prevented his competently performing intellectually challenging job tasks over the period &, as far as anyone knows, was little different from anyone else, basically, outside of his job. Will be an interesting defense to watch. Tourette's syndrome is not a personality disorder.
I think they're trying to say that the disorder would explain the *letters*. In other words, the letters, which the prosecution has offered as evidence that he molested, actually mean that he is, essentially, a needy drama queen and nothing more.
I didn't see anywhere that they are admitting he molested and then using the disorder to condone *that* behavior.
My ass.
Blumeanie: why are you such a whiner even embracing a state of mind you can change, even picking a name so people will have pity on you because you are sad. You make me sick!!!. Buck up and deal with it. Quit feeling sorry for yourself. It's time to get a grip and more than likely your medication makes it worse. LOL. Get off the meds and deal with yourself. You are probably some lazy person using depression as a crutch not to do anything in life. I cannot stand people like you...Boo hoo hoo. If you actually had a real problem to be depressed about, you probably wouldn't be. You should like some Emo homo.
13....I think you have Tourette's Syndrome wrong. TS is characterized by tics or involuntary movements. It is not a behavioral problem.....only a motor function problem mainly in the young.
david-3891268 - You are correct. People who are dealing with TS have no control over their tics and verbal utterings.
IF, Mr. Sandusky has a mental condition, it could be RI - Reasoning Impairment. Or, maybe M.A.O.I.S., Middle Age Occupational Impasse Syndrome.
From what I have learned about this case, Mr. Sandusky is a serial pedophile. He made the choice to do what he did, and it has absolutely nothing to do with a mental condition.
He craves having sex with younger males. More likely than not, that is learned behavior. If the truth were known, Mr. Sandusky was probably sexually abused when he was younger, and he was just repeating what happened to him long ago.
I hope the judge jumps all over the defense attorneys for trying to get away with such a lame tactic.
I also have disease. It is called don't mess with boys (or girls) fools or die. Now that is an undiagnosed disease because I could not find any hint of it when I ran a Google.
This monster should be thrown into the football arena at Piss POOR U and the citizenry having paid ten bucks for admission would have a shot at kicking the freaks ass or smacking him in the head with a large building block.
No way this monster should ever be allowed to breathe fresh air again.
And I am not revealing how I really feel about this pervert.
And then when he has been dispensed with perhaps his devoted wife could be forced to run the track around the field while the 100,000 or more in attendance threw all sorts of fresh garbage at her. If she lasted two hours she would be allowed to return home if not too bad.
Boy o boy I am in a very generous mood today and quite charitable don’t you agree?
It doesn't matter unless he has an IQ so low that he can't tell right from wrong. Since that doesn't appear to be the case in this situation, Mr. Sandusky needs to go to jail, Penn State needs to man up and take responsibility for their lack of action in protecting children.
@Miss Copper's Mom:
Man up? What does that even mean you sexist piglet?
Is pullmyfinger13 serious? Adults put themselves at the back of the line. Period. Don't know who you are, but my son had Tourette's. Don't pretend Sandusky can hide behind that mask
Vlad TepesJr: I was actually responding to someone who was trying to make an excuse for depression. I'm not on meds, I did get over it, and my argument was that depression is NOT an excuse for doing horrible things. Why don't you learn to read, or learn to stop jumping to conclusions because you're too ignorant to comprehend the shapes on the page that form words? Or better yet, why don't you crawl back under your rock where you can be as hateful and rotten as you like without bothering the nice people who can do things like eat with utensils and breath through their noses?
Toxic...I believe Mom meant grow some balls...be brave like a man...sort of like cowboy up...which means grow some balls and do what any good cowboy would do...
Doesn't sound sexist to me...
No matter. He knew he was doing something wrong, that's why he hid it. He should get life if found guilty.
Yes vlad you make 0 sense just a rant and Toxic I almost ignored you but then your comments would collapse on my page and I want to read what you have to say becuse you made no sense at all. As if you do not comprehend. As far as Sandusky and the psychiatric visit it does not make a difference half the people that do abhorred things and are convicted have a psychiatric problem. They will treat him in Cell block-D. Life for the lives he has knowingly made miserable. He knew exactly what he was doing without a doubt. Statistics show once a predator starts they do not stop until they are caught. D-Day has come for him. He knows it and his wife knew something or she was one DUMB HATFIELD. If the one said he yelled and SHE was in the house....SHE HEARD. He will go down. Oh by the way tourettes has nothing to do with the crime of anyone depending of course on the crime. They are treated medicinally in CELL BLOCK-D as well! Hang em High or Be nice CUT IT OFF and givr him an ankle bracelet. hahahahaha.
like all crimminals lately saying they have a mental illness to get out of what they have done now he is going to pull that crap. pedophlia is a choice that usually a adult man makes it is not a illness and I say usually a man but we know there are women out there too molesting children. but I find most men feel they have the right and believe the only true love is with a child that is untill the child grows up and they go get another younger child . it is wrong and nothing will ever make it right . but as for sandusky he is a perve who was into power and control over the young boys he was molesting /rapeing . he needs to spend the rest of his life in jail. this is one crime that needs to be wiped out forever.
pullmyfinger13--Are you serious? The "uncontrollable behaviors" in Tourette syndrome are physical and/or verbal tics or outbursts that come and go in less than a second. Comparing momentary tics to repeated, months-long episodes of grooming behavior is a gross insult to Tourette's sufferers. It also makes me wonder how closely you identify with ol' Jer.
Why is everyone picking on Jerry? He was born that way.
@Toxic Kitty. I'm old not sexist. "Man Up" is just a generic phrase used to say be honest, accept your responsibilities, do the right thing. You made me laugh with that comment. Piglet! LOL!
My wife is a PhD psychologist and I discussed this with her. (She is a researcher not a clinicial, but knows her stuff nonetheless.) The issue with Histrionic Personality Disorder is that the behavior that Sandusky exhibits (if the witness testimony and Sandusky's letters and short story are to be believed) is not HPD. HPD centers around a personality disorder that makes the person need to be the center of attention and the recipient of all attention. It is NEVER about showering attention on others. In fact, people with HPD get very uncoimfortable when attention is given to others, including, and especially when they are forced to give attention to others. If anything, Sandusky's showering of attention on the boys would be substantial proof that he is not uncomfortable when others get attention.
There are several things about this trial that are making me a little suspicious. It is a dirty little secret in the legal defense world that some lawyers, if confronted with overwhelming evidence (of a confession) of their client's guilt, when the crime(s) is serious enough, they will literally throw their client under the bus.
1) After several of the witnesses, observers in the courtroom noted that Sandysky's defense attorneys seemed shocked at the testimony and acted as though they didn't know what to do next. Through discovery they would have known everything the victims would testify to. The only reason they would have had to act surprised is if they had advised their client that the victims would testify differently or if the shock is for their client's consumption only.
2) The defense lawyers have stated over and over that the victims are in it for financial gain. Then they allowed the Bob Costa interview where Costa said that if all these people were making all of it up, that Sandusky had to be the unlukiest man in the world. They actually allowed rebuttal of their own defense. I would have expected that they would have fought tooth and nail to keep the interview away from the jury because it was so incredibly damning. And if it had to come into evidence, that they would have pushed for a transcript only and not the televised interview.
3) This HPD "defense" is bogus and Sandusky does not fit the clinical symptoms (according to my wife.) And worst of all, it allows the prosecution to have a forensic psychiatrist to interview Sandusky and present his findings, something that would not have been possible otherwise. Any clinical psychiatrist will disavow the HPD diagnosis, but will be able to offer their own psychological theories without restriction.
4) If Sandusky were to be found not guilty by reason of insanity by virtue of the HPD defense, it would be potentially worse than a life sentence in prison. He would be committed immediately to a residential psychiatric prison hospital. These places are chronically understaffed and underfunded but cannot turn away any court-ordered committment. As a result "patients" in these facilities are usually given massive doses of anti-psychotic drugs that will leave then slobbering zombines sitting uncomprehendingly in front of a TV set. If the least resistance is encountered they will be put in restraints --- tied down to a bed --- potentially foir the rest of their lives. Any attorney knows that the punishment that would result from a successful HPD strategy would be worse than prison. The only thing that I can think of that might indicate some sympathy for Sandusky would be that he might live a little longer in a psychiatric facility than a prison.
5) Even though the Fifth Amendment protects Sandusky against self-incrimination. They could have used this to keep the Costa interview from the jury and did not. In fact, they have said to the jury over and over that Sandusky will be taking his stand on his own behalf. They have created a situation whereby Sandusky will most likely be a horrible witness and that now if he does not testify the jury will believe that he did not because he would have sounded so guilty. Especially since the jury has already seen the Costa interview.
6) The defense lawyers also are making a big deal out of saying that the victims are in it for the money. The prosecution has already undercut that argument by pointing out with each victim that only two of the 14 or so victims have suyed anyone and both of them were boys that were molested and then covered up by Paterno/Spoanier/Curley/Schultz. They are not suing Sandusky and are not suing Penn State for the molestation. They are suing because the Penn State authorities covered up their complaint. This is not quite the same as "in it for the money" and durely the defense attorneys know that this has already blown up in their face.
I have been on two juries where it was very obvious that the defense attorney was going to make sure that the jury had certain facts to make their decision. In one, the plaintiff had committed an armed robbery, but if convicted would also get a life sentence for a third serious felony. Just two days before the crime was committed, the man had been released from prison for armed robbery/manslaughter. The prosecution could not raise the issue of the man's past crimes because that is inadmissible. So the defense attorney asked him, where were you in the weeks before the robbery happened. The witness scowled as he said that he was in prison for manslaughter/armed robbery. Needless to say if he is alive he is still behind bars.
I think that there may be some of this here. The defense lawyers could well be throwing Sandusky under the bus because they believe the charges against him. No one would ever try to prove that they did it and they would never admit it, but still it DOES happen.
Dirty dog, do you need to have the differences between sex with another consenting adult and sex with a child who cannot and did not consent explained to you? One is a crime and one is not. Can you guess which one?
And this is just the tip of the iceberg. Open your eyes at others (the religious darlings) that continuously molest their boys as a religious rite and spread all kinds of BS to support it--Freaks, all of them.
This is a must read:
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4240096,00.html
these prediators always cop a insanity plea.. he knew what he was doing and he knew he could get away with it attacking innecense children.. the university also turned a blind eye because of the money.. this animal's wife should also be charged .. she knew what was going on in her own home.. if you hear children screaming you shoud investigate . he is a pig and should be found guilty as his crimes against children.. imagine what these children went thru .. it is sick... twisted horror .
Tourette's causes involuntary physical movements, tics, and verbal outbursts. It does not cause someone to molest children. I've never heard of histrionic personality disorder causing someone to molest or rape, either.
He molested those boys because he wanted to; he knew it was wrong.
Sandusky obviously doesn't have any excuse. Period.
All that's really left is if the folks in Bellafonte, PA make this guy pay for his crimes!
A personality disorder is not a mental illness. it is usually caused by extreme damage at a very young age while the personality is being formed. So it becomes damaged. however, these people with personality disorders do know right from wrong. they just don't care. if they want to do something, they will do it, and rationalize it all afterward. The greatest percentage of violent criminals in prison have antisocial personality disorder, which is psychopath. A histrionic pd, may be mean he is concerned for his health and goes to the doctor a lot, worrying that he has some kind of illness. Histrionic could also mean he is only concerned about himself and not about others. And that could well be. However, a pd is NOT an excuse, it is NOT a mental illness. And since even people with PDs know right from wrong, it should have no bearing on this pedophilia case at all. sure, they can put it into the records. but it doesn't change anything, either way.
Willow,
You are partially correct but I don't think you totally understand HPD. All personality disorders have to meet specific criteria of symptoms according to the DSM (Diagnostic Statistical Manual) that mental health professionals use as their diagnosis "Bible". While beliefs about personality disorders are changing, it's more that there is a range of severity rather than a specific "cut score" about when there is a personality d/o and when there isn't, not whether it's a mental illness. By definition, all personality d/o must be present (i.e., the symptoms fit the diagnosis requirements even if it wasn't specifically diagnosed) before the mid 20s in a person's life. Symptoms cannot start after that point and meet criteria.
Further, HPD generally doesn't manifest itself by going to the Dr a lot. Also, none of the PDs are characterized by not knowing right from wrong (which is, I believe, the legal definition of criminal insanity). Antisocial PD doesn't care but that's the only one. Finally, there isn't a strong correlation between having HPD and being a child molester. (maybe with being a movie star...jk) Nonelessthess, I can't think of a single DSM diagnosis that would mitigate Sandusky's responsibility and matter. I'm only a psychologist though, not a lawyer or a judge so my opinion doesn't matter that much.
Strange, how no one thought he had any kind of disorder until AFTER his criminal acts had been discovered... I am not a psychiatrist or a psychologist but I think he would qualify as a narcissistic a$$hole, more than anything else! He knew what he was doing to those poor kids was wrong, but did not care...... anymore than he cared what happened to those poor kids because of his abusing them!!!
I really don't give a rat's behind, what he did was in-excusable. He should fry for what he did.
Elaine...he should fry? I agree, but only after the parents of those children had their go at him. Of course, by then, there wouldn't be much left to fry. (Evil grin)
He has a morality "disorder," is what he has.
Sorry, I tried to edit the above to make read differently, but the program is not allowing me to edit.
He has a morality problem. That is what he has.
Sandusky (spit-ooey) is certainly a sicko. whether he ends up in a nuthouse for the rest of his life or a jailhouse for the rest of his life is sort of immaterial.
what is important is he be locked down like a rabid skunk forever.
for that's what he is.
You are right Lisa, he has a morality disorder. The man is evil.
I just hope he doesn't end up in the nuthouse. They can let them out within a few years.
Frying would be to good for this loser. I hope and pray that something so ridiculous does'"t get him off.
Hopefully no jury is that stupid. They probably won't care about mental state, just what he did.
yes, hopefully the jury is NOT stupid like the Casey Anthony jury...
Personality disorder or not, he's a creep and a monster for abusing those innocent boys and wrecking their lives forever. WHY he abused those boys isn't why he's on trial and doesn't change the bottom line...his actions were wrong and illegal, and should be punished for his crimes to the full extent of the law. Pedophiles canNOT be rehabed
Regardless of any disorder, if he is competent to know the difference between right/wrong and legal/illegal activities, he is accountable for his actions. I find it hard to believe he could be a coach at a major university for this many years, and try to claim mental disorders that would excuse him from this type of criminal behavior.
Just like the church covered up/transferred perverted priests, this school and members of its faculty looked the other way regarding Sandusky. One guy actually saw him molesting a child. Did he stop him, kick is butt? No. His excuse is he told someone. Well when nothing happened, when Sandusky kept coming to work--that should have been his clue to go to the real police.
They all make me sick.
MaryAnn-Tampa
Perhaps go review the sequence of events? Shortly after the reporting of the shower incident Sandusky was prohibited from being on campus. It would appear SOMETHING was done... granted just not enough.
Personally I don't care what "disorder" he has/had he needs to go to prison for a VERY long time.
I don't think the defense attorney is planning to use the psychiatric defense to excuse the pedophilia. I think he is going to use it to discredit the interpretation that the letters are meant to "groom" the victims. He's going to say they are just an expression of the illness, not evidence of grooming.
That said, I think the defense is grasping at straws. This guy looks like toast to me.
If he knew enough to try to force the boys he molested to keep quiet and not tell their parents, then he clearly knew it was wrong/illegal. I agree that the defense doesn't have much to back their claims.
Trust me... it should not matter. And the fact that these lawyers think they can paint the victims as money grubbing fakes is reprehensible. Anyone that has been sexually assaulted is aware of how the system tries to protect the entitled and famous folks. So sad.
Actually, he is sociopath of the worst kind. He feels "entitled" to do whatever he damn well pleases, like our people in Washington DC. So my behavior is acceptable, because I am better than all you people. That is how a sociopath behaves. And they're everywhere. The latest example of this is U.S. Secretary of Commerce being in two car accidents in one day. The Commerce Department is empowered to promote commerce within the US and throughout the world with US trading partners. AND what was he driving? A TOYOTA LEXUS!!!!!!! Americans, you should buy American; me, I drive whatever I damn well please. His name is John Bryson, and boy, does he have brass balls!!! It's infuriating!!! These two clowns are the poster boys for sociopaths.......
Yeah, it certainly wasn't a bad enough disorder to slow him down. that's for sure. He was capable of doing these things, for his own gratification. I used to work in a prison that was 75% sex offenders. And the great majority of them were high on drugs or alcohol when they did their crimes. Because they knew right from wrong, and could keep themselves straight, unless they lowered their inhibitions with drugs or alcohol. Then they'd get in trouble. this guy was not on drugs or alcohol, he was just doing what he wanted, when he wanted. I think, somehow that's even worse than the other guys.
GTFO! That was the only BS his lawyer could come up with???
Mr. child molester, you are going to die in jail and noone will shed a tear. Hope they throw your brain dead, I didn't know what he was doing with those boys in the basement, wife in there with you.
I've often felt the same way about his wife too. What the hell was with her turning her back to all this? Is everyone sure she is innocent also???????????????????
And what about joeperv, i bet dollars to donuts he was involved also.
Why would you want to accuse Joe? There is not one shred of evidence that he was involved
The-COG
steve-691807 said it about right... but lets presume he was doughnuts involved... what would you propose? Should we dig him up, try him and execute him?
We don't have to abuse Paterno's corpse, but let's stop the "He's an innocent legend!" nonsense. If he was innocent, he was too stupid to be immortalized in death.
If he were to admit that he molested the children sexually, then it might matter if he a had personality disorder that made his actions hard to resist or stop. He might get a slightly lighter sentence, or even spend some time in the looney bin. But he won't admit to the molestation at all, so it seems to be a vain attempt to cast doubt with at least some member of the jury. It won't work, and I hope it makes things worse for this calculating pervert.
Mental disorder? Heifer dust.
A pedophile is a pedophile is a pedophile. Even a sociopath/psychopath knows that pedophilia is wrong.
Sandusky didn't care what he did to these young people. It was about getting what he wanted when he wanted to the detriment of the young lads.
This is why such crimes against our children should be automatic death penalty, mental ill or not. Obviously there is no cure.
DKJ-4 -- the recidivism rate among sex offenders is off the chart -- there is NO rehab, no treatment, nothing that changes them -- chemical castration doesn't even really work -- there was a documentary about this a some time ago and the men all admitted that they should NOT be released into society, that they would all re-offend.
How many of you are Jewish, and do not voice your opposition to this? Talk about pedophiles.....
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4240096,00.html
OMG, there are even more things in this world that are horrible. I really thought I'd heard it all. But obviously not.
This disorder has never been connected with pedophilia. It's shameful to even try this as a defense. What's next? "Sorry I got a headache, so I felt I needed to rape someone?".
I guess the more money one has and the more famous, the more extravagant the excuses can be. If he is guilty - level the maximum amount possible against him. Crimes against children in my book are the most heinous kind.
This defense will NEVER work. The defense team in on the ropes and now are grasping at straws. He's going to jail for the rest of his life. And they all know it. Such a shame so much had to be brought up again by these young men.
If he had ANY decency, he would have plea guilty and saved so much more suffering.
Jerry -- I agree they're grasping at straws. Of course the man has a disorder. Actually more than one: (a) any pedophile has a disorder. This is not normal behavior. (b) He seems to be convinced he did nothing wrong, meaning he's a sociopath. (c) This man only thinks about himself, like, "poor me; how can they do this to me." That, too, indicates that he has a screw loose. I hope he gets a number of consecutive sentences and spends the rest of his life in jail, preferably in the general population, that or put him in a cell and throw away the key.
Betcha Bubba is awaiting. Or maybe they will put him in protective custody (in the hole, he will have a lot of time to think). I have always thought joeperv was extremely weird, even before this. Betcha Paterno and the wife were voyuers.
Susi-Oh -- I believe you are exactly right. Agree with everything you said!
Agreed. Why would any firm even take this case? Clearly his attorneys find themselves without so much as fingers with which to grasp said straws and are attempting to spare Sandusky the inevitable death sentence he will receive once placed in the "general population". Hella cruel, yet not so unusual.
If he had any decency, he wouldn't have raped little boys. Poor bastard can't even Moonwalk.
Emo-Eating Possum
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
Does that answer your question?
He will be placed in a facility with more just like him for his safety. They will attend some BS counseling and get to sit around and share stories. I work in a prison that has these animals in it. They enjoy freedom because they're all alike, no one to confront them.
A personality disorder cannot be used as an excuse. It is not a mental illness, it does not take responsibility away from the abuser. Ted Bundy had a personality disorder, and it certainly didn't slow his sentence down (any more than normal, anyway). A large percentage of people in prison and on death's row have a persoanlity disorder.
Statement by David Clohessy of St. Louis, Director of SNAP, the Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests (314 566 9790, SNAPclohessy@aol.com)
We’re not lawyers or psychologists. But we can’t imagine Sandusky’s latest legal gambit succeeding.
A therapist can say you're histrionic and the law can still say you're a criminal. One doesn’t rule out the other.
And even if Sandusky’s “grooming” is not deemed criminal, surely his grabbing, groping and raping will be.
Histrionic personalities are very, very common. So is so-called oppositional-defiance. Do not believe that either LABEL is ANY so-called 'disorder' when individual 'personality' is so unique......
These 'labels' are completely bogus - and entirely demeaning - no human personality is ever static.
And neither label has to do with MORALITY - or LEGALITY. It is the LAW that, in this case, was ignored.
The young man who screamed aloud was not 'oppositionally defiant'.....but responsive to his specific environment...(different story).
Psychology is nothing but a speculative psuedoscience, and as useless as one's surroundings are changeable.
Those who would write this article and pose the question--that a personality disorder is a defense--are just writing psuedo science. In the case, here, the man is a rapist. There is no psychology involved. So, yes, this case does not involve psychological questions. It involves pyshcological questions when things are one-time acts involving murder. But, as a psychologist, I must say, if you did the crime you should get the time. There is no psychological defense as far as I'm concerned.
"Oppositionally defiant"?
"Responsive to his specific environment"?
What the @!$%# does that mean?
Sounds like psychobabble to me.
Tina.....
"Oppositionally defiant"?
"Responsive to his specific environment"?
What the @!$%# does that mean?
Sounds like psychobabble to me.
It is - and it isn't.
Please consult any professional psychologist / social worker / teacher / the DSM manual / or Google......and EDUCATE YOURSELF! This is standard terminology in current use.
You can look up the definitions for yourself.
All children - and many adults, if not most - REACT to their specific environments. Wake up.
More people could have related to the real meaning of Histrionic Personality Disorder if it had been referred-to by its colloquial name: Drama Queen.
ladycoastguard,
While you may have the terminology correct, the way you are talking about it shows that you don't really understand the science of psychology. Yes, I said science. It's not pseudo science. There is a LOT of very sound research associated with virtually every sub-field within psychology. Having said that, you are correct that there isn't any diagnosis that should make a difference in this case and I am hopeful that the jury understands enough about it to get that point.
Also, GeneralEclectic....I have to totally agree with you. It would help the general population understand what HPD "looks" like if they used that term. I'm seeing too much confusion with characteristics of Antisocial Personality d/o on this thread and the only shared characteristic is that impulse control isn't good with either one.
This is a laughable defense. My heart breaks for the victims who have to re-tell these horrid events. The idea that they are only doing this to get money is ridiculous. Like there is any amount of money that they get that could make up for this kind act. The money will hopefully assist them in getting the therapy they need since we now live with managed care and so many don't even have mental health insurance. If people knew the kind of destruction being abused causes for a person long term they wouldn't blink about the money. I hope Sandusky enjoys his new bunk mates in prison. He will be in protective custody because even in prison they can't stand phedophiles. His wife and the Penn State staff that failed to stop him should have adjoining cells.
When you are a married man with kids and grandkids, you know what's right and wrong. Did he molest his own kids/grandkids? This is a question as yet unanswered for me - I don't know if his relatives were interviewed. If he didn't, clearly he knew what he was doing was wrong. If he were incapable of differentiating between what is OK and what is not, he would have been more indiscriminate because such people cannot help themselves. Sandusky could, and he did, he helped himself to a bunch of vulnerable kids. He knew it was wrong. I agree with the person who commented earlier - if he had any decency or remorse he would have pled guilty. He didn't because he is trying to save his behind and his money.
It is also sad that no one from the football program has expressed any views - don't they feel anything about the fact that their precious program and fame are built on the grave of many children's innocence? I want to know if they would entrust Sandusky with their own kids. It is easy to stay quiet - this university, its football program and everyone involved lack guts. If I were any of them, I would be ashamed of the association.
Yes! One of his own grandsons accused him of molesting him and his mother brought charges.
Status and greed have taken over college and professional sports arenas. We need to
stop worshipping idols. In this case, the lives of these now young men have
been shattered and there is no excuse(or defense) for that.
the university administration will keep out of the line of fire as long as they can. There are probably some serious legal,ethical and moral issues that will need to be addressed in the courts. As to the greed in college and professional sports, college football is a billion dollar business,no different from the pros. The coaches make more money than the president of the universities, and are not really answerable to anyone. I don't watch college or professional football and only read enough on-line or in the newspaper to at least be able to keep up a conversation in a social situation.
On one of those predator shows on MSNBC, they asked a sex abuser of young teens, that since he has a daughter that age at home, couldn't he see that it was wrong. The guy said it was wrong for anybody to mess with HIS child. But he didn't really connect it with what he was doing to someone else's child. He said he would kill anyone that hurt or abused his child. they asked him if he had abused his own child. "Of course not. She is my daughter!" There are some weird people in this world.
I believe pedophilia is a personality disorder; however, it is one for which death or prison without the possibility of parole is the only answer. It doesn't matter to me whether you classify it further or not. What ails him can't be cured. We all know that. He'd be doing everybody a favor if he would commit suicide.
Oh - he's got a mental disorder, that forgives all. Nope, sorry - all pedophiles could be classified as "abby-normal". Almost all adults don't get turned on by little kids and act on it. He knows right from wrong, why did he hide it? He needs to be in with the general population and get a dose of his own medicine from Bubba and the boys.
I used to work in a prison that was 75% sex offenders. Talking to one of the therapists there, she said that if I was a guard (I was not, I am a nurse), you would see a large percentage of the pedophiles sleeping UNDER their bed in the corner. Most pedophiles were molested themselves. I wonder if the good feeling (of sexual nature) which causes guilt, also kind of halts his development at that age. So if he was molested at 10, maybe he sees 10 year olds as sexual objects. Regardless, pedophilia cannot be cured. these are the people that should stay in prison. Because they will reoffend within days of getting out of prison. And certainly all pedophiles were not abused either, but I guess a certain percentage have been.
No it doesn't matter if he has a personality disorder. He knew right from wrong. He consciously acted to violated the law and the innocence of his victims for his own self-fulling needs.
I have a cure for his disorder. A permanent one.
He has a disorder alright. He needs to be castrated and sent away for a long, long time.
Lock Him Up!
Until there is a cure for this kind of disorder (when hell freezes over) then he needs to be put away so as to not repeat the crime against children.
If I kill you, does it matter if I'm a sociopath or just flipped out?
um, No?
Are you asking me? Or is that your final opinion?
It matters not a hoot about this guy's so called Personality disorder. Hitler we all agree was a nut job. But I would prefer what Adolf would have done to this Sandusky guy to what punishment WE give him. Bottom Line; It won't be NEARLY severe enough. ADOLF would have dealt with him properly.
"Does it matter if Sandusky has a personality disorder?"
No.
Yes.
No.
I've worked with people with personality disorders.
They didn't rape children.
Tina, I helped raise two stepdaughters, who were eventually diagnosed as antisocial personality disordered. They wouldn't rape children. However, they might drown them. Seriously, these two girls attempted to drown my dog, a rooster, and the younger one actually did drown 8 baby chicks. I watch the news in their town, because I expect to see them in it.
A person with a personality disorder is virtually always conencted to reality, and as such, knows what he/she is doing. They tend to think it is normal for them! There doesnt seem to be any real connection between a personality disorder and pedophelia, which is a sexual attraction to pre-pubescent children. It is extremely common for pedophiles to have been victimized themselves, and as such are stuck in the emotional sexuality of the age at which the act occured. Sandusky would enver be able to claim "insanity" because people with personality disorders arent usually insane. He IS responsible for his behavior, knew what he was doing, that it was wrong but may not have been able " to help himself" so to speak. Regardless, such people need to be put away if the commit such crimes to protect society.
What he did is from a personality disorder...that does not excuse him at all! He needs to get the punishment he deserves. The fact that he see's nothing wrong with what he did..proves he a danger to society. A piece of @!$%#..is just that and all the perfume in the world wont change it from being a piece of @!$%#!
Prison is for people who can't live by the rules of society. We call this behavior "anti-social" because it is contrary to a peaceful society. At any time, we could simply call anti-social behavior a 'personality disorder' but it wouldn't change the fact that people who routinely exhibit anti-social behavior should go to prison and not some sort of mental institution. So in Sandusky's case, call it whatever you want, but he still needs to go to prison for the rest of his hopefully short life.
Husband just burned pasta....omg... cooking for almost an hour....pot is as black as night...
this is what happens when you get distracted. Thank goodness the house didn't burn down.
He is scrubbing his brains out on that pot. Ahhh revenge is sweet! Just had to vent.
Sandusky will have to pay the price and I hope his victims will be able to move on with
their lives.
f imurder, torture, arson, child rape are from disorders . . . who's ever responsible? Sandusky made a choice, just like anyone else. His choice did extreme harm to defenseless children. When those children grow up and they do harm because of Sandusky's "disorder" is it them "ok"? They will spend years learning to cope with the damage he's done to them. We're all responsible for our behaviors and choices, and some behaviors and choices are so terrible that the only "cure" is imprisionment.